The Chinese and Asian Art Forum. For Fans, Collectors and Dealers.
Basic Rules For the BidAmount Asian Art Forum: Talk about whatever you want. You can even discuss and offer things that are for sale if they are authentic. Maximum image file size per post is 2 MB. Images of 700pxl x 700pxl are optimal if saved at a medium resolution. Be respectful of others and enjoy yourself. Click the YouTube link for a brief tutorial on using the forum. You can also EMBED Videos by cutting and pasting from You-Tube, Vimeo etc.
NOTE: To post an item or add a new post, click open the category title from the FORUM LIST, and CLICK the Blue ADD TOPIC button.
@lotusblack Thanks Brian, I appreciate your input, and it seems we will have to agree to disagree on this point.
This is interesting for me as I know so little about stones, I often even find it hard to see what the carved item is supposed to depict.
My question on the origin of this is would imperial carvers have persisted fashioning a pendant for an empress if the inclusions were going to leave it with the appearance of having been roughly carved? I would have thought it may either have been finished and sold off as as a lesser quality piece, or simply discarded as soon as the effect was clear.
@julia Hi Julia, Here's a pink tourmaline snuff bottle carved from pink tourmaline and was sold as 'probably imperial' by Bonhams.
Here's another carved tourmaline snuff bottle attributed as imperial by Christie's:
These pieces are roughly the same size as my pendant.
I suspect Cixi was a lover of the type of pink tourmaline shown here, as opposed to dark pink tourmaline or red. We may view this type of material as 'lesser' but I think that would be applying a modern interpretation of 'quality' onto the personal preference of an Empress Dowager whose life fell mostly in the 19th century.
I think you may have misunderstood me, I wasn't commenting on the quality of tourmaline per se, but of the specific piece that your pendant is formed from.
Maybe I have misunderstood, I genuinely know nothing here, and all tourmaline has inclusions so carving into them can't be avoided?
"Probably," does not mean it is and "Imperial" does not mean it belonged to Cixi, the family was large, the common outcome of multiple wives and concubines. Plus, the practice of giving diplomatic and personal gifts was a common practice. The pendant will have to stand on its artistic merit or you will need to find a "sale" history on the item. If it went with no history to a sale, then that amounts to a good dining out yarn to spin at table preferably after a generous cocktail hour, probably.
@sharonp Thanks Sharon.
I’m currently trying to locate a text called: Yu Shanpu, 1985, 'Cixi Lingmu' in: Yu Bingkun, p268
Within it is a description of the items placed into Cixi’s mausoleum and takes its reference from the original Palace archives, including the record of a ‘red tourmaline gourd and bat pendant’.
Any help would be appreciated so that this can become more than a ‘dining out yarn’.
@tony-brams maybe submit to Peter for assessment and also ask him if he has a copy of the text you're seeking.
@johnshoe I have a lot of respect for Peter, and I've gone to him before for questions regarding Chinese porcelain, but I don't believe his specialty lies in Chinese gemstones. I suspect I need to locate an expert that specialises in Chinese gemstone snuff bottles of the 18th and 19th century.
@lotusblack Hi Brian, I want to bring this back up because you didn’t mention in your comment that the dark red pendant you shared is made from amber.
Amber has a mohs hardness of 2-2.5, whereas tourmaline is actually harder than nephrite and jadeite, with a hardness of 7-7.5.
Bear in mind that you can’t cut jadeite or nephrite with a steel blade, and tourmaline is even harder than that.
I could carve into a piece of amber using a plastic credit card.
I’m really not interested in debating this further. I’m of my opinion you have buyers tunnel vision nothing I can say will change that. The fact that your pendant is likely modern and still probably valuable will just not be good enough for you. I refuse to buy into this fantasy that it’s imperial and belong to Cixi. This week I was in an auction and involved in bidding on a pendant everyone agreed was Qing. It was exactly how a hand worked pendant should look and feel. It was not Imperial or even considered but the carving and polishing was superior to your piece. I sent you and imperial carved pendant and now you are trying once again to sell a fantasy narrative that a plastic credit card could have carved that imperial pendant. I live in the United States and have become accustomed to false narratives being pushed instead of productive debates. Once again your pendant to me is just to sharp the outlines are etched and not carved the areas that should be raised relief are just etched with boarders hand carved lines and boarders are to straight and consistent the polishing is high speed buffed and rushed it look manufactured and sloppy the bats face is all V cuts. It simply has no flow. I could be wrong as everyone could be but the comparisons I have seen are just not there for me in this pendant at the end of the day I would probably try to prove it’s hand carved before the the story that someone broke into Cixi’s burial chamber and you just happen to find it and that’s the reality. Nothing personal but I hear stories like this every other day at estates 99 percent are just stories. Now everyone also experts will give you an opinion but at the end of the day it really comes down to if you like it or not. The market will decide its valve not stories.
I sent you and imperial carved pendant and now you are trying once again to sell a fantasy narrative that a plastic credit card could have carved that imperial pendant. I live in the United States and have become accustomed to false narratives being pushed instead of productive debates.
The amber pendant you shared was not attributed as imperial, unless I'm mistaken?
In other news I've found this lovely pink tourmaline snuff bottle dated to the late Qing period with very similarly shaped carved leaves in high relief as found on my pendant:
So far I've only seen these shaped leaves on tourmaline carvings, perhaps a consequence of the characteristics of the stone? Or possibly just the stylistic approach of a single workshop working at the time?
@tony-brams apples and oranges the leaves are rounded and polished no boards on raised reliefs the polishing is consistent with the period not high speed buffing the cut turns are crisp and fluid not choppy and marked. It’s that tunnel vision again you are taking one thing from many pieces and creating your own narrative. Plus the rendering is just different. Let’s compare closer with know Qing examples.
Hum what picture seems out of place that bat carving is just amateur at best I don’t see flawed areas on the other examples look at your leave it’s so sharp no polishing or rounding was considered where is the polishing abrasion that is left on period pieces it on the other two examples. You see any V cuts on the other two examples like the bats head.
Latest Post: Makuzu Kozan bowl Our newest member: James Close Recent Posts Unread Posts
Thanks for visiting "The BidAmount Asian Art Forum | Chinese Art"
If you sell on eBay, or have a shop feel free to post images and descriptions and links.
Check back often for discussion about the latest news in the Chinese art and antique world. Also find out about the latest Asian art auctions at Sotheby's, Christie's, Bonhams and Tajans.
Auction results for: fine porcelain, ceramics, bronze, jade, textiles and scholar's objects. As well as Japanese, Thai, Vietnamese and other Asian cultures.
Thank you,
Peter Combs
Topics and categories on The BidAmount Asian Art Forum | Chinese Art
Kangxi vases, Kangxi dishes and chargers, Kangxi ritual pieces, Kangxi scholar's objects, Qianlong famille rose, Qianlong enamels, Qianlong period paintings, Qianlong Emporer's court, Fine porcelain of the Yongzheng period. Chinese imperial art, Ming porcelain including Jiajing, Wanli, Xuande, Chenghua as well as Ming jades and bronzes.
Join the BidAmount Chinese and Asian art discussion board and forum today
The BidAmount Asian Art Forum | Chinese Art
A free Asian art discussion board and Asian art message board for dealers and collectors of art and antiques from China, Japan, Korea, Thailand, Cambodia, Vietnam and the rest of Asia. Linked to all of the BidAmount Asian art reference areas, with videos from plcombs Asian Art and Bidamount on YouTube. Sign up also for the weekly BidAmount newsletter and catalogs of active eBay listing of Chinese porcelain, bronze, jades, robes, and paintings.
The art of calligraphy - and for the ancient Chinese it certainly was an art - aimed to demonstrate superior control and skill using brush and ink. Calligraphy established itself as one of the major Chinese art forms during the Han dynasty (206 BCE - 220 CE), and for two millennia after, all educated men were expected to be proficient at it.
The Museum’s collections of Asian art span nearly five millennia and encompass the cultures of China, the Himalayas, India, Japan, Korea, and Southeast Asia. In 2007, the Museum launched an initiative to create dedicated galleries for the collection, beginning with a gallery for the arts of Korea ...
Chinese art is full of symbolism, in that artists typically seek to depict some aspect of a totality of which they are intuitively aware.
China Online Museum is the finest online museum of Chinese art. It features Chinese calligraphy, painting, ceramics, bronzes, carving, and other artworks.
Chinese Ceramics & Works of Art. Overview Upcoming auctions Contacts Auction results ... Christie’s sales of Chinese ceramics and works of art showcase centuries of Chinese history. Held throughout the year in London, New York, Paris and Hong Kong, they attract a wide audience of collectors and connoisseurs vying for pieces as diverse as ...
Explore Asian Art Week. Contact the Specialist Department. Chinese Paintings ... Senior Specialist, Head of Sale. [email protected]. Tel:+1 212 641 5760. Bid in-person or online for the upcoming auction:Fine Chinese Paintings on 10 September 2019 at New York. Bid in-person or online for the upcoming auction:Fine Chinese Paintings on 10 ...
Discover an abundance of must-see art from all corners of a vast continent at Christie’s NY Asian Art Week. From contemporary classical and Chinese paintings to works with exemplary provenance from the Art Institute of Chicago, our Rockefeller Paza galleries will be full of ancient treasures and contemporary masterworks in a salute to the vibrant arts of Asia.
Sold to benefit The Art Institute of Chicago’s Asian Art Acquisition Fund, the sale features 84 lots with a focus on Ming and Qing porcelains, and offers a rare insight into the taste for collecting Chinese ceramics and works of art in the Midwest from the end of the 19th century through the 1980s. Highlights include two Wanli wucai garlic-head vases, a Qianlong mark and period, blue and ...
Specialist, Chinese Paintings, Christie's London Dr Malcolm McNeill is a Specialist in Chinese Paintings at Christie’s, based in London. He previously worked as an assistant curator of the Chinese collections and the Victoria and Albert Museum in London, as a researcher at the British Museum, and as a translator and tour guide at the National Palace Museum in Taipei.
The Christie's Education 2020 Conference: The Chinese Art Market 18 Jun 2019 Christie’s Education is delighted to announce our first international academic conference in Asia which will take place in Hong Kong from 26-27 November 2020 at the Hong Kong Convention and Exhibition Centre and will run in parallel with Christie’s Hong Kong Autumn Auctions.
The summer Chinese Art sale in Hong Kong will feature works of art from several private collections, including Qing porcelains and textile from the collection of the legendary Chinese art dealer A. W. Bahr (1877–1959), fine gilt bronze Buddhist sculptures from an old Hong Kong collection, an East Asian collection of Qing dynasty wine cups and jades, and a Japanese collection of Song ceramics ...
Sotheby's Chinese Works of Art Department holds two auctions each year in London, New York, Hong Kong and Paris.
Chinese Art - View Auction details, bid, buy and collect the various artworks at Sothebys Art Auction House.
With more than 340 Chinese works of art dating from the Neolithic to the Republic periods, highlights of this sale include a selection of Qing Imperial monochromes from the collection of Arnold and Blema Steinberg, early ceramics from the Art Institute of Chicago and Chinese porcelain and works of art from the collection of Henry Arnhold.
Results: Sotheby's Asia Week achieved $52.4 million in six strong auctions, exceeding pre-sale estimates. With 76.5% of lots sold and 60.3% of lots surpassing high estimates, the Asian art sales at Sotheby's indicate continued collector interest in the finest works of art from China, India and and the Himalayas.
Today's sale of Important Chinese Art will proceed as planned with sessions at 10 AM and 2 PM EDT. Sotheby's will be monitoring the weather conditions throughout the day and will be available to coordinate alternative bidding options should conditions make it difficult for clients to attend the auction in person.
Bonhams Chinese Art department is renowned for offering the finest works of art representing the richness and breadth of China's artistic heritage, particularly Imperial porcelain, white and spinach green jades, cloisonné and Buddhist art. Specialised international auctions are held globally, including London, Hong Kong and San Francisco.
Bonhams : Chinese Works of Art We use cookies to remember choices you make on functionality and personal features to enhance your experience to our site. By continuing to use our site you consent to the use of cookies. Please refer to our privacy and cookie policies for more information.
Bonhams Fine Art Auctioneers & Valuers: auctioneers of art, pictures, collectables and motor cars. We use cookies to remember choices you make on functionality and personal features to enhance your experience to our site. By continuing to use our site you consent to the use of cookies. ... Chinese Art (US) General enquiries
Bonhams : Fine Chinese Art We use cookies to remember choices you make on functionality and personal features to enhance your experience to our site. By continuing to use our site you consent to the use of cookies. Please refer to our privacy and cookie policies for more information.
Bonhams Fine Art Auctioneers & Valuers: auctioneers of art, pictures, collectables and motor cars Bonhams : Asian Art We use cookies to remember choices you make on functionality and personal features to enhance your experience to our site.
Bonhams are international auctioneers of fine Chinese and Japanese art. We specialise in rare Imperial and Export Chinese ceramics and works of art, as well as Japanese ceramics, fine and decorative works of art from the Neolithic Period to the 20th century. View on map
Bonhams Fine Art Auctioneers & Valuers: auctioneers of art, pictures, collectables and motor cars. We use cookies to remember choices you make on functionality and personal features to enhance your experience to our site. By continuing to use our site you consent to the use of cookies. ... Asian Art Bonhams. Work. 22 Queen St.