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This vase sold for $9200 on ebay 2 months ago. It looks like a 19th century vase to me with this bottom and color. Any idea why it sold for nearly 10k?
It’s a bit difficult to see but if it there’s a pendant border on the neck, they were used from the 1940s on.
Birgit
One possibility is this was a 'fake ' auction , for what purpose I don't know, but if you look at the bidding process, all are listed as 'bidder's identity protected', which always makes me suspicious.
The seller seems to sell both real and fake stuff, if you check his/her sold items list.
tam
If the highest bidder doesn't pay is it still shown as ''sold''.? If fake, he surely hasn't paid eBay's commission on 10k. Do you agree it is a 19th C. vase? You can't see the bidders in all of his past auctions. What would be the purpose to fake this? Give himself credibility? Make serious buyers believe it is worth more?
It looks like an early Kangxi piece to me. The quality of painting is quite irritating. It's not what you expected from Kangxi, right? At early Kangxi period the cobalt blue is just like you see on these photos, greyish blue, not bright at all. Heavy body thick walls. Imperfection on the base and on the top rim.
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Xin,
You are a legend with your highly informative posts and knowledge regarding chinese porcelain.
Mark
Dear Xin,
I am new on this site and don’t know well all members but I must say that your competence is evident in all your posts that I have seen up to now.
Nevertheless I do not agree with you in this case.
That vase is not Kangxi to me; difficult to say, without handling it, if it is a late 19th century copy or a recent fake. I tend to believe the second as the more probable one.
It is true that all types of blue can be found on Kangxi ware. What is not convincing is the painting style. The figures are too much stiff, the faces are wrong, the way the shades of blue are applied too is wrong, the ropes are not fluently drawn, the trees on the back are not in the correct style. The contour lines of the rock are completely off. The decoration style of early Kangxi is much more bold, it has a strong personality.
Similarly important, the potting is wrong. These rouleau vases has less slanted shoulders, that brown tinge on the exposed paste of the foot should not be there and the pit holes on the base really look purposely made, they are too large. The real ones are made by surfacing bubbles in the glaze, those are made by dispersing burning particles inside it.
There are other points which are difficult to explain to me. Not convincing at all, anyway.
I am posting here a similar vase sold by Piasa in 2012. Pity that the picture is small, nevertheless even with a so small picture the difference of the painting style is evident.
The high price fetched is not a surprise. There are a lot of not competent bidders there. They have been fooled by the “attic find” story and the glaze frittings on the upper rim, besides the fact that it comes from Europe.
In my opinion, “reading within the lines”, the seller knew that it is not Kangxi.
Giovanni
Clay and Brush,
I agree with you, the vase looks to be a modern one but distressed around the mouth to appear to have age. To my eyes, it's done to look old but misses on a number of counts.
First is the overall glaze has too much of a bluish tone instead of snow white or milk-white, which oddly turns whiter on the mouth/rim.
The cobalt decoration is to me the wrong color and lacks the classic washes of sapphire blue seen most often to fill in areas and missing the gentle shading typical of period pieces. The shape generally looks odd in particular the proportions from the shoulder to the base of the neck. Then the "fritting" around the mouth looks intentional and not as a result of natural firing which isn't common on this type of vase to begin with due to it's thickness. Fritting typically happens where the piece has been trimmed to very thin thicknesses.
In this catalog are several Kangxi vases of this shape, including a blue and white example. They I think are handy for comparison.
http://online.flipbuilder.com/mpdm/mwwv/mobile/index.html#p=41
Also a link to a few that sold at Christie's, most on the first row.
best, Peter
Peter
I think Xin was sort of stating that he was not happy with the irritating painting, hence not period. Just the way I was reading his post
I pity the mug who bought it!
I also agree with clay's assessment about whether the seller was aware or not about it being authentic. The pun of being an attic find and playing dumb played directly into the FOMO emotion.
Mark
If you look at the chinese antiques 'sold items ' lists on ebay , sorted by highest price, many of these seem to be fake. Whether the transactions ever get completed or not is not clear, but often items will appear twice or more in the list , as the seller has to relist when the buyer does not pay.
I think , or guess , that new bidders get carried away, get into a bidding war , and then get buyer's remorse and simply disappear.
The other more sinister possibility is that there is some money laundering scam going on. This happened several years ago in auction houses in the south west of England , where a Chinese seller deposits a fake item into auction, gets two bidders to send the price to astronomical levels , he pays the auction commission, and uses his money to pay for the item, and now has a receipt for money received from the sale , and the money is clean. The 'buyer' is of course his employee/friend. The auction houses were either in on the scam, or didn't care.
Someone, I forget who, wrote a blog exposing this scandal , and directly implicating the auction houses, but I never heard the upshot. But you could work the same scam on ebay, with a co-operative seller.
tam
Here is one in the Chinese Shanghai Museum, with similar designs but the colour is different.
It should start at 39 minutes and 15 seconds
Dear Giovanni,
Thank you for correcting me. I agree with you. I just gave my first thought and I was wrong. I never judge things totally without looking at them in person (I'm not experienced enough to judge from photos). I always happy about critics from you and all other members.
Thanks Peter for giving us a lot of hint too.
I'm still learning about things here, not teaching.
PS:There are also bad pieces from Kangxi period, never think that Kangxi porcelains are always beautiful.
Well, my conclusion: This COULD be a new vase. 🙂 ? This greyish blue happend sometimes when the temperature was not perfect or mixed cobalt material (cheap one with expensive one) was used. Even through Kangxi period.
Sorry guys.
WBR
Xin
www.wyssemaria-art.com
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Dear Xin,
you are absolutely right. I have seen Kangxi pieces with very dull cobalt blue, but still no doubt Kangxi.
What I pay attention to is at first glance the painting style. The “hand” is the most difficult aspect to replicate. All the rest, paste, glaze etc comes after. Of course they must be of the proper type.
Giovanni
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