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I'm not convinced this is a modern copy. I'm not saying it's transitional, but in the hand it certainly doesn't have the fell of a modern copy.
I went to look at a "transitional" beaker vase, which was well rendered but it was immediately obvious in real life that it was new (not obvious at all in the photos). I've attached some photos of the new copy.
The porcelain in of my vase is also consistent with the transitional period. It has many impurities. It was sold to me as a late 19th / early 20th vase and that what it looks like / feel like in real life.
One thing that is worth pointing out is the scale. I should have mentioned it before, but this is roughly half the hight of most transitional vases at around 23cm or so. So the quality of the painting and figures might may have misled people looking at the photos. The artist, to me, seems to be actually pretty good, considering the scale of the work. Here are some photos with my hand in to give you a better idea of the scale the work was done in. I know the base is wrong, but it is worth looking at the colour of the paste. It is very white and very dense underneath the messy areas.
Even in the photos I think you can see the difference in the quality / consistency of the porcelain between the two. One is obviously new, my vase is obviously not new imo. Another thing is the cobalt blue on my vase looks very good to me
It’s modern.
Forget about what aspects of the porcelain could suggest the vase has age… we all know that kind of thing can be faked.
Just look at the artistry, the clumsy brush strokes, and the flatness of the cobalt that seems to show no piling whatsoever.
Oh well, I like it so I'll keep it. The immortals are my cup of tea, I only paid £80, so it's a keeper for me
@greeno107 Are you sure there's no piling? are you looking at the beaker vase, which I referred to as fake or the original vase that this topic started out with?
@thomasumjohnson This is your vase, right?
I think Giovanni had already given a very fair assessment, but since you still seemed to have some doubts, I decided to post.
It’s really important to step away from trying to find what seems ‘correct’ about a piece, in order to justify what is incorrect.
I know it’s hard to do that, but one defect of the design is one defect too many for a piece to be genuine.
And, as Giovanni stated earlier, the style of translation wares were not copied in late Qing into Republic periods.
I ask this question a lot, but I don’t often post it because it upsets people….BUT, it’s an important way of self evaluation.
Forget the components of the porcelain for a moment….
What did you find artistic and beautiful in this piece that you thought it could be genuine transltional ware?
@greeno107 I'm not saying it's transitional. I'm saying that it is possible that between the 17th and 20th century someone made a transitional style vase. I know the story that no one made transitional vases in these 300 years, but common sense tells me that one or two or 3 might have been made during this period.
To be fair, Tom has said he doesn't think it is genuine, nor is beauty a defining distinction otherwise Giovanni would not have been fooled, however I agree this vase does not have the beauty and artistry of transitional wares.
However, what might make this, say, a 19th c copy? If the style was not copied into subsequent centuries why would someone try to make one if there were no demand?
I can't help thinking that workers of this skill level would be reacting to demand, not trying to create demand by introducing a new style. The artist does not have the skill to do that. I look at the dashes and wavy lines being used to fill space and hurry the work and cannot see this artist being successful enough to have the leisure time to indulge a desire to recreate an old still that no one appears to have been interested in purchasing. If there were demand we would see more transitional copies made later. Besides, it would not just be his time, but that of the potter. Sorry, Tom, but for these reasons I believe your vase is a later 20th c copy of lesser quality made to order with a purpose to decieve - or for resale to tourists, possibly.
Having said that, I have seen 1 or 2 allegedly 19th/20th c transitional vases, but they were on artfox.live which I don't feel comfortable with and brings us back to Birgit's earlier remarks.
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