The Chinese and Asian Art Forum. For Fans, Collectors and Dealers.
Basic Rules For the BidAmount Asian Art Forum: Talk about whatever you want. You can even discuss and offer things that are for sale if they are authentic. Maximum image file size per post is 2 MB. Images of 700pxl x 700pxl are optimal if saved at a medium resolution. Be respectful of others and enjoy yourself. Click the YouTube link for a brief tutorial on using the forum. You can also EMBED Videos by cutting and pasting from You-Tube, Vimeo etc.
NOTE: To post an item or add a new post, click open the category title from the FORUM LIST, and CLICK the Blue ADD TOPIC button.
This vase isn't a million miles away in terms of design and composition...
@thomasumjohnson one difference is that on the dragon your dark circles sit inside circles instead of diamonds like on Sotheby’s dragon. But, I haven’t studied to see if that is vital. Yours even has a luting line, which is not hard to copy. I must say, I probably would have been fooled… unless seeing the foot rim in person would have kept me away. I’m not good enough on decoration yet.
I'm not sure why anyone would make a modern copy of a 19th century copy of a kangxi vase. As already stated some would pass the footrim for kangxi, so why not just stick double circles or a 6 character mark on the base? Rather than try to make a copy of a c19 vase worth ten times less than an original kangxi. It's hardly worth the effort.
These are very common pots made in and for the Vietnamese mark I have personally sold several of them the south eastern market tend to make their dragons and cloud differently and request the difference from Chinese potters. Usually these have tin embellishments. This is just my opinion.
@thomasumjohnson 19th c revival pieces can go for thousands of dollars so it's plausible it would be worthwhile financially to copy them.
I think there is a fine line between "authenticity paranoia" and healthy skepticism, that I at least think gets very blurred each time pieces are discussed here. So I'm gonna try to make some points that might be valid.
I'm guessing that at any time during the 19th century, there were thousands of people who decorated porcelain, both for domestic as well as foreign consumption. That means that the subject matter will be interpreted differently, depending on who holds the brush.
In that same line of reasoning, there was probably the same number or even more potters, so forms will also vary to some degree, depending on who potted the pot.
I remember a video Peter made a while back, where he mentioned that there wasn't a school that mandated how to trim footrims. Again, there will be some variation, depending on an assortment of factors, of how a footrim will look.
There is bound to be color variations, as there wasn't the same purification processes at the time, as we have today (best example I can think of right now, is the different variations of underglaze blue during the kangxi period).
In Peter's video about the sacking of the summer palace, the number of looted items is put at 1.5 million (not all porcelain of course). That is probably still less than 1% of all the porcelain made in China up till the end of the Qing dynasty (both for the domestic and foreign markets).
Of course, alot of those pieces have been lost, but as I think we all know, porcelain used to be a precious commodity, so it got repaired and still kept.
Another point that someone else already made in another thread on here is the lack of interest from ordinary people, who can't tell the difference between an older piece and one of those horrid washed out pieces of blue and white from the 70s and 80s. That means that good stuff does turn up in flea markets, thrift stores and similar places, because people don't care about it. Not saying it is common, but it does happen.
Well, rant over. Thanks for listening.
~ Decorative Arts, Antiques and Accessories, at Mollari's ~ www.mollaris.com
@lotusblack that makes some sense, just like the vase I posted before of a similar composition, regarding the Vietnamese market..
@iluvatar that was a damned good rant. it is frustrating to hear someone glibly say that the color is wrong, the shape is wrong, the design is wrong. if they are wrong, what is the right color, shape, and design? and do you honestly believe that there is only 1 color, 1 shape, and 1 design?
At one point i was gathering different examples of rose colored peonies from christies porcelain examples and of peach bloom and noticed a very sizeable variety of color tone and application of enamel.
authentication is art and science which must be approached with an open fluid mind. skepticism is warranted because the good stuff is the distinct minority. however, mechanical ham-fisted treatment is not the path to identification success.
The keys to assessment are 1. quality of art 2. composition of enamels and paste (oxidation, purity, coherence) 3. foot rims 4. evidence of wear. 5. and form anachronism. i am sure that a few more consideration could be added.
@tonyatl We can disagree without having to get insulting. "Glibly" and "ham fisted"? You say you want people to have an open mind, but one thing that is is sure to close minds is when you take personal shots at people. That is unnecessary and counterproductive. We're all trying to learn and help each other here, so let's not lose sight of that just because someone has a different opinion.
@johnshoe I don't think anyone's calling you ham fisted... Or anything is directed at you personally. He's just talking about the different approaches people take towards authentication
@tonyatl We can disagree without having to get insulting. "Glibly" and "ham fisted"? You say you want people to have an open mind, but one thing that is is sure to close minds is when you take personal shots at people. That is unnecessary and counterproductive. We're all trying to learn and help each other here, so let's not lose sight of that just because someone has a different opinion.
i didn't take any personal shots at anyone in particular and had no one in mind with my remarks. i was simply recalling and conflating many experiences over the years reading or listening to people talk about reasons why something was or was not authentic.
i don't care that anyone has a different opinion. that is what having an open mind is all about. but if those different opinions are not specifically and cogently substantiated, then the conversation and differences are not productive. generalities don't help me in connecting with an opinion.
interestingly enough, peter addressed this very issue in his latest video this past week. he said that differences of opinion are part and parcel of the game. he was speaking in connection with a big debate about some garlic vases.
@tonyatl to me, it sounds like you are trying to invalidate the opinions of those who disagree with you by name calling when they don't offer enough proof to satisfy you. Hopefully that's not the case, but that is certainly how it sounds.
I have sat through court ordered divorce mediations with fewer grudge matches going on, it is all opinion, you are free to take it or leave it.
Thanks for visiting "The BidAmount Asian Art Forum | Chinese Art"
If you sell on eBay, or have a shop feel free to post images and descriptions and links.
Check back often for discussion about the latest news in the Chinese art and antique world. Also find out about the latest Asian art auctions at Sotheby's, Christie's, Bonhams and Tajans.
Auction results for: fine porcelain, ceramics, bronze, jade, textiles and scholar's objects. As well as Japanese, Thai, Vietnamese and other Asian cultures.
Thank you,
Peter Combs
Topics and categories on The BidAmount Asian Art Forum | Chinese Art
Kangxi vases, Kangxi dishes and chargers, Kangxi ritual pieces, Kangxi scholar's objects, Qianlong famille rose, Qianlong enamels, Qianlong period paintings, Qianlong Emporer's court, Fine porcelain of the Yongzheng period. Chinese imperial art, Ming porcelain including Jiajing, Wanli, Xuande, Chenghua as well as Ming jades and bronzes.
The BidAmount Asian Art Forum | Chinese Art
A free Asian art discussion board and Asian art message board for dealers and collectors of art and antiques from China, Japan, Korea, Thailand, Cambodia, Vietnam and the rest of Asia. Linked to all of the BidAmount Asian art reference areas, with videos from plcombs Asian Art and Bidamount on YouTube. Sign up also for the weekly BidAmount newsletter and catalogs of active eBay listing of Chinese porcelain, bronze, jades, robes, and paintings.
Ancient Chinese Art - Ancient History Encyclopedia
The art of calligraphy - and for the ancient Chinese it certainly was an art - aimed to demonstrate superior control and skill using brush and ink. Calligraphy established itself as one of the major Chinese art forms during the Han dynasty (206 BCE - 220 CE), and for two millennia after, all educated men were expected to be proficient at it.
Arts of Asia | The Museum of Fine Arts, Houston
The Museum’s collections of Asian art span nearly five millennia and encompass the cultures of China, the Himalayas, India, Japan, Korea, and Southeast Asia. In 2007, the Museum launched an initiative to create dedicated galleries for the collection, beginning with a gallery for the arts of Korea ...
Chinese Art: Characteristics, History - Art Encyclopedia
Chinese art is full of symbolism, in that artists typically seek to depict some aspect of a totality of which they are intuitively aware.
China Online Museum - Chinese Art Galleries: Home
China Online Museum is the finest online museum of Chinese art. It features Chinese calligraphy, painting, ceramics, bronzes, carving, and other artworks.
Chinese Ceramics & Works of Art | Christie's
Chinese Ceramics & Works of Art. Overview Upcoming auctions Contacts Auction results ... Christie’s sales of Chinese ceramics and works of art showcase centuries of Chinese history. Held throughout the year in London, New York, Paris and Hong Kong, they attract a wide audience of collectors and connoisseurs vying for pieces as diverse as ...
Fine Chinese Paintings | Christie's
Explore Asian Art Week. Contact the Specialist Department. Chinese Paintings ... Senior Specialist, Head of Sale. [email protected]. Tel:+1 212 641 5760. Bid in-person or online for the upcoming auction:Fine Chinese Paintings on 10 September 2019 at New York. Bid in-person or online for the upcoming auction:Fine Chinese Paintings on 10 ...
Asian Art Week | New York | September 2019 | Christie's
Discover an abundance of must-see art from all corners of a vast continent at Christie’s NY Asian Art Week. From contemporary classical and Chinese paintings to works with exemplary provenance from the Art Institute of Chicago, our Rockefeller Paza galleries will be full of ancient treasures and contemporary masterworks in a salute to the vibrant arts of Asia.
Chinese Art from The Art Institute of Chicago | Christie's
Sold to benefit The Art Institute of Chicago’s Asian Art Acquisition Fund, the sale features 84 lots with a focus on Ming and Qing porcelains, and offers a rare insight into the taste for collecting Chinese ceramics and works of art in the Midwest from the end of the 19th century through the 1980s. Highlights include two Wanli wucai garlic-head vases, a Qianlong mark and period, blue and ...
Chinese Art in Hong Kong: A Brief ... - Christie's Education
Specialist, Chinese Paintings, Christie's London Dr Malcolm McNeill is a Specialist in Chinese Paintings at Christie’s, based in London. He previously worked as an assistant curator of the Chinese collections and the Victoria and Albert Museum in London, as a researcher at the British Museum, and as a translator and tour guide at the National Palace Museum in Taipei.
The Christie's Education 2020 Conference: The Chinese Art ...
The Christie's Education 2020 Conference: The Chinese Art Market 18 Jun 2019 Christie’s Education is delighted to announce our first international academic conference in Asia which will take place in Hong Kong from 26-27 November 2020 at the Hong Kong Convention and Exhibition Centre and will run in parallel with Christie’s Hong Kong Autumn Auctions.
Chinese Art | Sotheby's
The summer Chinese Art sale in Hong Kong will feature works of art from several private collections, including Qing porcelains and textile from the collection of the legendary Chinese art dealer A. W. Bahr (1877–1959), fine gilt bronze Buddhist sculptures from an old Hong Kong collection, an East Asian collection of Qing dynasty wine cups and jades, and a Japanese collection of Song ceramics ...
Chinese Art Auctions - Chinese Paintings ... - Sothebys.com
Sotheby's Chinese Works of Art Department holds two auctions each year in London, New York, Hong Kong and Paris.
Chinese Art | Sotheby's
Chinese Art - View Auction details, bid, buy and collect the various artworks at Sothebys Art Auction House.
Important Chinese Art | Sotheby's
With more than 340 Chinese works of art dating from the Neolithic to the Republic periods, highlights of this sale include a selection of Qing Imperial monochromes from the collection of Arnold and Blema Steinberg, early ceramics from the Art Institute of Chicago and Chinese porcelain and works of art from the collection of Henry Arnhold.
Important Chinese Art | Sotheby's
Results: Sotheby's Asia Week achieved $52.4 million in six strong auctions, exceeding pre-sale estimates. With 76.5% of lots sold and 60.3% of lots surpassing high estimates, the Asian art sales at Sotheby's indicate continued collector interest in the finest works of art from China, India and and the Himalayas.
Important Chinese Art | Sotheby's
Today's sale of Important Chinese Art will proceed as planned with sessions at 10 AM and 2 PM EDT. Sotheby's will be monitoring the weather conditions throughout the day and will be available to coordinate alternative bidding options should conditions make it difficult for clients to attend the auction in person.
Bonhams : Chinese Works of Art
Bonhams Chinese Art department is renowned for offering the finest works of art representing the richness and breadth of China's artistic heritage, particularly Imperial porcelain, white and spinach green jades, cloisonné and Buddhist art. Specialised international auctions are held globally, including London, Hong Kong and San Francisco.
Bonhams : Chinese Works of Art
Bonhams : Chinese Works of Art We use cookies to remember choices you make on functionality and personal features to enhance your experience to our site. By continuing to use our site you consent to the use of cookies. Please refer to our privacy and cookie policies for more information.
Bonhams : Fine Chinese Paintings and Works of Art
Bonhams Fine Art Auctioneers & Valuers: auctioneers of art, pictures, collectables and motor cars. We use cookies to remember choices you make on functionality and personal features to enhance your experience to our site. By continuing to use our site you consent to the use of cookies. ... Chinese Art (US) General enquiries
Bonhams : Fine Chinese Art
Bonhams : Fine Chinese Art We use cookies to remember choices you make on functionality and personal features to enhance your experience to our site. By continuing to use our site you consent to the use of cookies. Please refer to our privacy and cookie policies for more information.
Bonhams : Asian Art
Bonhams Fine Art Auctioneers & Valuers: auctioneers of art, pictures, collectables and motor cars Bonhams : Asian Art We use cookies to remember choices you make on functionality and personal features to enhance your experience to our site.
Bonhams | Asian Art in London
Bonhams are international auctioneers of fine Chinese and Japanese art. We specialise in rare Imperial and Export Chinese ceramics and works of art, as well as Japanese ceramics, fine and decorative works of art from the Neolithic Period to the 20th century. View on map
Bonhams : Asian Art
Bonhams Fine Art Auctioneers & Valuers: auctioneers of art, pictures, collectables and motor cars. We use cookies to remember choices you make on functionality and personal features to enhance your experience to our site. By continuing to use our site you consent to the use of cookies. ... Asian Art Bonhams. Work. 22 Queen St.