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Here is another part that seems to have repair. The more I look, the more I think I see signs of age. 🤔
Well, I'm not getting my hopes up too much especially as it seems no one can accurately evaluate Chinese bronzes anymore as seen in the other thread. There were a lot of bronze censers made in the 18th and 19th c.
I am very excited to get it - it's taking longer that I like to arrange shipping. I have just the place to display it, too. I seem to have a soft spot for foo lions. 😍
Update: I realized this morning that there is a link to high resolution photos and there are shots of the inside bottom.
I am cautiously optimistic that this has some age. While obviously not of imperial quality it shows skill and beauty and might either be 18th c. Qianlong or imitation Qianlong from the late Qing. (It's marked Xuande.) It's really too bad it was polished!
Up to 20 years ago these Chinese bronze incense burners weren't much in demand; one like this (same height, the one seen in the blurry photo I shared) identified by Christie's as Qianlong sold for around 300 pounds (Nov 11th, 1999).
BTW, is there an archive at Christie's with auction catalogues from 24 years ago? I need to keep researching.
After watching Peter's video on archaic style Chinese bronzes, I think it probably came with a matching stand originally.
Yes, that is a pin. Thanks for pointing that out.
Hi Brian,
I've been doing some homework on late Chinese bronzes to see if I could learn more about techniques. A couple of books I ordered arrived but, alas, they only cover ancient bronzes, so another one's on the way ("Late Chinese Bronzes" - no mistake there!).
I did find this post by Peter on a Ming bronze that has handles that were cast separately and attached so it apparently was a thing they did on late bronzes.
When I was at the Museum of Fine Arts Boston on Sunday, I noticed a pair of Qianlong bronze vessels that had attached handles, although the butterfly screws are modern so not sure if they were damaged or the repair was preventative. (They are quite large and displayed on the grand staircase.)
The hard copy of the Christie's catalogue from the 11/11/99 sale with the similar censer arrived and the photo is much more detailed - it looks very very similar to mine with a few differences in decoration. As I noted earlier, they are both 11" tall.
Warm regards,
Steve
Hi John,
If Christie's is right, I believe mine is also 18th century although because of the damaged lid I don't think it's that valuable. What compelled me to buy it, besides the fact that the bids didn't go very high, was its beauty. I teach western art history so I'd like to think I have a good eye although I've been fooled before.
Hope your censer tomorrow is a winner. Will you update us? Good luck!
-Steve
Hi Brian,
FYI: I found evidence that post-casting assemblage, including handles attached with pins, began during the Song Dynasty. The following is from "China's Renaissance in Bronze; the Robert H. Clague Foundation" (found in the reference section here at Bidamount), pp. 18, 21-22:
I have seen pins on handles that are antique most of the Japanese bronze used pins. Plus pins were used during mold making. But Because it has pins in one period doesn’t mean it was used in another. Plus size would be a factor. The censer you purchased I think is still manufactured its small and shouldn’t need pins plus I see machined groves but the lid is pretty unusual form for Chinese 18th century censer. I’m still not convinced but better pictures of the insides will help. One other thing I’m seeing the plugs on a lot of bronze fakes right now. Still just need better pictures.
Update: In case you're interested in Peter's opinion, here's his appraisal. Spoiler: it was as advertised. 🙂
@lotusblack 11" tall is not small for a bronze censer. Plus, it's quite heavy.
I hope you don't mind an addendum to the story of the censer.
I've had it a couple months now and I can honestly say it's one of my favorite items. It's striking, the details are better in person and it provides a nice contrast to the porcelain. I enjoyed the process of learning more about bronzes and am now more appreciative when I come across them in museums, etc. Plus, it makes a fetching african violet cache (although the humidity in the interior perhaps might cause bronze disease?).
The lid, already damaged, broke in shipping and insurance covered the full cost of the item. I can rest the foo lion on top of the lid for display and because of that I've decided not to repair it as it would be too costly. When using the vessel as a cache I place the lid on a wooden base that compliments it.
In conclusion, while not worth a "fortune" in monetary value, I think 19th c. Chinese bronzes are generally undervalued at the moment, at least ones of good quality. The book "Later Chinese Bronzes" from the St. Louis Art Museum collection includes a beautiful example from the late 19th c. and maybe some day they will get the appreciation they deserve although I realize there were made in abundance.
Regards,
Steve
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