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Hi Sharon and Julia -
Sharon, I have copied Julia into this as it is a continuation of dating attribution …
The diamond dipper motif is one of the most common seen on these wares, and continues in use throughout the Ming dynasty …
In the ZT, JT and TS periods, this is seen mostly on guans, meipings dishes, bowls and some stem-cups, although these ate rare. As with all motifs, there are great differences in drawing styles, and these, up to a point, can be used to differentiate between the each period …
The ZT style is usually drawn in fine, precise lines, each stroke/element been clearly defined, as seen in image 1, a Guan in the Gugong, Palace Museum, Beijing …
In JT/TS periods, the design becomes slightly wider, as on my bowl, the lines are not so fine/precise and the elements and detailing are not so clear, the following examples, I hope, illustrate this …
Image 2, a guan in the Art Gallery, Chinese University of Hong Kong (this piece also has a beautiful drawn peony scroll to the shoulder, the flower petals and leaves very similar to my bowl, but the central blossoms drawn with spiral centres), attributed ti JT/TS periods …
Image 3, a guan in the Metropolitan Museum, New York, attributed to JT/TS …
Images 4/5, another guan in the Gugong, Palace Museum, Beijing, attributed to Jingtai period …
Images 6, a bowl in the Gugong, attributed to Tianshun period …
There are however, many anomalies …
I have seen pieces from ZT princely tombs which exhibit the usual fine/precise style, yet others which exhibit a far loser, less detailed design and which, if not for the dated epithet, would place such wares in to either JT/TS periods. These differences may be down to goods commissioned for burial, the loser style been acceptable for such, or differing workshops/kilns and artists as mentioned previously …
However, I have also seen pieces that were commissioned for princes/elites attributed to JT/TS were this design appears very close to the fineness and detailing seen on ZT pieces ..,
So, as with all wares from all periods, they are accepted norms but also exceptions to such rules. These three reigns encompass a 29 year period and, as such one must always allow for some flexibility in dating and cross overs between the different periods especially regarding private kiln wares, and look at the object as a whole …
Stuart
Hi Steve -
I thought you might like to read Prof John Carswell’s discussion on this painting and his attributed dating of the porcelains included, from his ‘Blue and White’ - Chinese Porcelains around the World’, British Museum Press, published in 2000, pgs. 132/3 …
I would agree to his Hongzhi attribution, another example of type, D. 32.7cm, shown image 3, illustrated in ‘Chinese Blue and White’, old 1978 publication of an exhibition held at the National Museum, Singapore, pl. 43, pg 139 …
I have a similar large bowl in my collection …
Stuart
@ming1449 Thank you so much Stuart for the detailed explanation with examples, it is much appreciated. You and your willingness to share knowledge is valued. I will be reading it again several times, workers here today replacing a balcony, as if the hammering and power tools was not enough, they are young and listening to music, give me strength. Sharon
Stuart,
To be totally honest, your posts have guided me down the path of Ming porcelains, whether for collecting or for my business. You always write up such detailed and informative posts, they have helped me greatly.
Thank you for being so forthcoming with these examples, though I must admit I likely will never get my hands on such pieces....
Jeremy
Thank you, Stewart. That's very interesting.
I thought the Venetians would have imported at least a few Chinese porcelains by 1514 but it looks like I'm mistaken? They were still quite wealthy at the time and a premiere trading port in the Mediterranean. Would the bowls in the painting have to be the same Syrian bowls? Many of them were made and exported, no?
Hi Steve -
I believe that Prof Carswell is revering to parallel’s with Chinese ceramics found in Syria and Istanbul, or that’s my reading of the text …
The two larger bowls in Bellini’s painting certainly appear to have many of these aspects in overall shape, proportions and designs seen on such late 15th/early 16th century pieces, so Hongzhi/early Zhengde periods …
The ‘hypothetical’ attribution to Bellini’s eldest brother is highly unlikely, for his dates in Istanbul, 1479-80, coincide with the Chenghua period 1465-1487, and production of pieces decorated in rather dense painting style is not thought to have commenced until the very late 1480’s …
Stuart
Hi all -
Along with the phoenix/lotus dish, I also collected this bowl from my restorer. The last two images show after/before restoration to the side/rim section …
A brief update re attributed dating; after much discussion/updated research and debate between other known collectors, scholars and especially my HK teacher, a dating to the early/mid Jingtai period, so 1450/55, would seem appropriate. This is base upon the execution of/detailing seen within certain individual motifs, and known shape, body and footrim/base trimming characteristics …
Stuart
Thank you Stuart for the additional example slides following the last photo of the beautiful bowl. Sharon
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Chinese Ceramics & Works of Art. Overview Upcoming auctions Contacts Auction results ... Christie’s sales of Chinese ceramics and works of art showcase centuries of Chinese history. Held throughout the year in London, New York, Paris and Hong Kong, they attract a wide audience of collectors and connoisseurs vying for pieces as diverse as ...
Explore Asian Art Week. Contact the Specialist Department. Chinese Paintings ... Senior Specialist, Head of Sale. [email protected]. Tel:+1 212 641 5760. Bid in-person or online for the upcoming auction:Fine Chinese Paintings on 10 September 2019 at New York. Bid in-person or online for the upcoming auction:Fine Chinese Paintings on 10 ...
Discover an abundance of must-see art from all corners of a vast continent at Christie’s NY Asian Art Week. From contemporary classical and Chinese paintings to works with exemplary provenance from the Art Institute of Chicago, our Rockefeller Paza galleries will be full of ancient treasures and contemporary masterworks in a salute to the vibrant arts of Asia.
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Sotheby's Chinese Works of Art Department holds two auctions each year in London, New York, Hong Kong and Paris.
Chinese Art - View Auction details, bid, buy and collect the various artworks at Sothebys Art Auction House.
With more than 340 Chinese works of art dating from the Neolithic to the Republic periods, highlights of this sale include a selection of Qing Imperial monochromes from the collection of Arnold and Blema Steinberg, early ceramics from the Art Institute of Chicago and Chinese porcelain and works of art from the collection of Henry Arnhold.
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Today's sale of Important Chinese Art will proceed as planned with sessions at 10 AM and 2 PM EDT. Sotheby's will be monitoring the weather conditions throughout the day and will be available to coordinate alternative bidding options should conditions make it difficult for clients to attend the auction in person.
Bonhams Chinese Art department is renowned for offering the finest works of art representing the richness and breadth of China's artistic heritage, particularly Imperial porcelain, white and spinach green jades, cloisonné and Buddhist art. Specialised international auctions are held globally, including London, Hong Kong and San Francisco.
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Bonhams are international auctioneers of fine Chinese and Japanese art. We specialise in rare Imperial and Export Chinese ceramics and works of art, as well as Japanese ceramics, fine and decorative works of art from the Neolithic Period to the 20th century. View on map
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