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@watership Thanks for those observations. I wouldn't have thought to examine it in that way, so it is good to have it pointed out by someone with an eye attuned to those details. It's all part of the learning process. Thanks!
@imperialfinegems Mark, thanks for your assessment. What indicates to you something being poorly outlined? It seems very cleanly outlined in black all the way around with little if any bleed over outside the lines, which I had thought was impressive and unusual, so I'm just curious what you mean by that and if you can give an example of something well outlined that I could compare it to for educational purposes. Thanks so much!
Anyone who knows their porcelain will tell that this dish/plate is not from the Republic period or earlier. It's a PROC and from 70's onwards. Plain and simple!
When I write poorly depicted/outlined I am writing about the natural look of the depictions. The example posted looks stiff and not natural. It's also done with a degree of haste.
Beautifully painted ones look so real they could almost fly off the plate/other. Yours is in my opinion not one of those. That doesn't mean that today's artists can't do them. Of course they can and do in some instances. It's all about time restrictions and money.
The issue of so - called stickers has been around and used since the early 1990's as far as I know.
The plate you posted is not a fake! It's simply an attribute to a earlier time period. It's not trying to deceive or other. The stickers are imo a possible afterthought.
I know it can be difficult at first to be able to determine what is and what isn't. It takes many a year of study and handling in order to grasp the initial concept.
These are some images painted by renowned artist Liu Yucen (1904-1969). He was a member of the eight friends of zushan. His works are hotly sought after and copied today. Most copies can be easily spotted for obvious reasons. Just compare the quality of the two. Note the ways the bird is done. His head and angle for instance.
Mark
Yes, it does. I am not sure I have seen any decorated like this though.
@imperialfinegems Thanks for posting these. I'll keep studying. So much to learn, so many rabbit holes of confusion to get lost down!
@avionsunantiques I am looking up Samson marks online and cannot find any like these. Can you post a link to where this information can be found? Thanks so much!
Samson marks are all over the place. They can be very tricky, just like their works.
Many are not marked at all. Those that are, often have a fanciful Asian looking mark - sometimes made up on the spot. They are marketed to Europeans who can't read the marks anyway, so anything that looks Asian will do. Usually in Red.
I can't tell you what your plate is from pictures alone.
Samson is very tricky - in many cases you can't be sure, unless you match the pattern - particularly with the unmarked pieces. They tend to use common patterns for their pieces.
From what you can see in your photos, everything says samson, from the hard paste construction, to the "copied" decoration style, to the fanciful red mark on the side of the base. It would also explain why you apparently found several from the same set.
Its very unlikely this is a chinese plate.
@avionsunantiques That would explain a lot to me. My next question would be regarding dating. While others were basing their assessments of dating then to post 1970's in relation to the plates being Chinese, if they are Samson, they would have to be no later than 1969 when Samson shut down. But how much older might they be? Do you have any opinions on that?
I'm not the right person to ask about Samson. I know just enough to tell it from Chinese!
That said, I suspect the labels on your plate are probably legit, and if they provide clues, go with them.
I don't know how Samson responded to Tarrif Act mark wise.
This plate was probably made as part of a larger service, at a time when such decoration was popular in Europe.
As a guess, I suggest your plate is antique, somewhere around the turn of the Century.
I think @Avionsunantiques maybe correct with the samson theory. Here is a mark on a wucai style jar that bears a similar mark.
Interesting!
Mark
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