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These are my latest purchases in small local auction houses, we hope to have bought well of the period.
Agree with Mark. The bottom has these strange double rings that have no beginning and no end and seem printed.
I can’t say much about the blue vase but would expect more wear to the gold after 300 years.
Birgit
I agree with Mark, I don't think it is Kangxi, neither do I think the first is wanli - there a few reasons, for example the unfinished waves and strange brushstrokes where one wouldn't expect to see anything like that.
I feel the blue and gilt vase is a copy, too. It could be a later 19th c copy, but I am not convinced by the foot or the lack of wear.
Obviously, I agree with Birgit, too - I didn't see your post. 😊
I think our posts crossed, am happy we had the same idea about the wear.
Birgit
Your blue monochrome with gilt decoration has potential to be Kangxi.
I recall a couple of blue ground gilt decorated saucers that were in pristine condition.
These large Vases from Bonhams are very similar.
https://www.bonhams.com/auctions/25358/lot/74/?category=list#!
Although the a diffinative attribution for the Wanli vase is well above my skill set if I had to make a quick decision based on the foot rim alone I might just think it is Wanli. Let me explain, the paste looks to be typical good quality not the best quality. The sluffing of the glaze looks natural although I think the raised glazing edge could be a bit thicker. It has the all important oxide ring although only on the interior part of the rim. Appropriate minor pulling of the glaze as well as a bit of kiln grit. The rim appears to be hand finished and is dirty we’re I would expect it to be dirty. Looking at the oblique of the rim image were the heaping of the blue occurred, in many areas there is a blister that would have popped in the kiln.
It’s too bad the lack of precision in the brush strokes and the shoddy depiction of the dragon give it away as a reproduction (better than calling it a fake).
Just my thoughts.
Pietro, was this offered up as a genuine Ming vase?
Ron
I also think the blue and white dragon war could possibly be Wanli period but blue and white is not my strong side unfortunately.
Ach so! The people here comment the Wanli jar is fake. (I misread the posts.) But yes, it looks a little odd with the brush strokes but this is sometimes the case with Wanli and jiajing blue and white pieces, I think.
A Jiajing period blue and white jar that also look a little odd with the brush strokes for comparison.
Hi Pietro -
Wanli marked guans with motif combination of five clawed dragons chasing flaming pearls amongst clouds above waves/rocks drawn in this painting style are well known. They are also, unfortunately, heavily reproduced - to use Ron's frasing ...
Due to the huge numbers ordered by the Court for Imperial wares during the mid/late 16th centuries, quality declined and large variations in overall potting, painting styles, cobalt tones, application/shading techniques, mark writting, and trimming/finishing are seen on vessels of similar shape and designs ...
I to would be interested to know how this piece was catalogued/described when you acquired it from the 'small local auction house' ...
Would it be possible to post additional images of the interior and the other side of this piece?! ...
Stuart
Stuart and all, yes it certainly could be Ming of a lower quality. We are used to seeing this style vase with much better decoration and a top shelf price to go with. The issue in my mind is the large quantities of reproduction out there, unfortunately it has jaded every real dragon vase that does not have provenance or is behind glass in a museum.
Ron
Hi Pietro, Ron and all -
Attach images for comparisons in painting styles and motif combinations, both primarily and secondary, for these types of jars from Jiajing and Wanli periods ...
1:- Jar with dragon amongst lotus, H. 16.4cm, Jiajing mark/period, unearthed in 1958 from a princely tomb dated to 1591 in Nancheng, Jiangxi province ...
2:- Jar with similar designs, H. 14.5 cm, Jiajing m/p, Sangde Tang Coll, Hong Kong ...
3/4:- Jar with dragons chasing flaming pearls amongst clouds above rocks/waves, H. 14 cm, Wanli mark/period, Huaihaitang Coll, Hong Kong ...
5/6:- Jar with similar but not identical main design, H. 15 cm, Wanli m/p, private collection, Hong Kong ...
I hope these are of some help ...
Stuart
Stuart, these examples do prove your point. Pietro, I think your next move would be to get your dragon vase authenticated, Peter would be a good start.
Ron
Hello everyone,
the wanli vase was offered for sale simply as a Chinese vase, because the small local auction houses in Italy have no experts.
it could also be a lower quality ming vase.
Two yuan vase was always sold in this auction.
I am attaching here the photos of the vases sold, unfortunately I don't have the photos of the foot.
one of the pots I think was good.
thanks a lot to everyone.
Piero
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