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I am interested in this piece offered by a dealer, I am interested in thoughts on if the piece is a new forgery or if it is old. If it is old what era? Some parts seem almost like Han, other parts almost like Song. If it is an old piece thoughts on area of manufacture S.E. Asia or China? Any information will be welcome, thank you.
John
Hi John,
I can't help, sorry. It looks an attractive piece, hopefully someone will be able to assist you with it.
How big is it? It might also be helpful to know what the dealer is saying about it.
Julia
That is an awful wide mouth. A spittoon? Funerary jar? Todd
take it with a grain of salt
Hi John,
glaze and form remind me of South East Asian pottery. The most similar I could find is this Sankampaeng jar from Thailand. The other jar has a different mouth but looks more similar in form. (Source: The Ceramics of South-East Asia by Roxanna M. Brown). Cambodia is another possibility. I may be on a completely wrong track though because there were Chinese influences in these countries, so if some expert says it's Chinese it most probably is. A picture of the bottom would be helpful, also the size and what the dealer says about it, as Julia already noticed.
Birgit
I agree probably not Chinese but rather Thai/other.
It appears to my little eye that it looks to be very old and would definitely warrant further research to validate its true origin and probable period.
Mark
Hello Julia,
Thank you so much, here is the description from the dealer
Early Chinese Pottery Vase with wide mouth and loop-belt handles with a light brown glaze. c. 6th- 8th cent. Measures approx. 11 ¾” tall and 9” wide.
In the past I have found this dealer to be honest, but I think in many cases people describe a piece as best they can, and how it was described to them has a strong influence. I do not think it is a modern copy, but it does look more S.E. Asian to me than Chinese.
John
Thanks John and I see you have had some helpful opinions, too. Let us know if you decide to get it.
It seems to be in extraordinarily good condition for its age? I can’t see a single chip, crack, hairline, nibble or any age-related wear.
Did the dealer provide a photo of the base?
Nic
It‘s not that difficult to find old SE Asian items in perfect condition. A great lot has been unearthed in the last years and if you have a trustworthy dealer it’s no problem. Another reason might be that these items are rather sturdy and heavy and not easily damaged.
Birgit
FWIW, here are a few Chinese examples from the "Complete Collection of Ceramic Art Unearthed in China" each sharing some similarities to John's jar.
Wow, you’re in possession of that book, Kaolin! I think you’re right, the vase might indeed be Chinese and the age given by the seller could be right.
Birgit
Hi Birgit. It's actually a set of 16 volumes. : )
But here is my disclaimer. I have the good fortune to live in Paris and on the same metro line as the Musee Guimet (Asian Art Museum). They have a library of over 100,000 volumes. I spend a lot of time there photographing ceramic books from cover to cover for my database.
As we all know, Asian Art books of good quality are very expensive and those that are out of print can be much more so. I suggest to anyone that they check any museums, universities and other libraries that they may have in their area to see what books might be available to the public. One doesn't have to check them out. With a good smartphone and the right ambient lighting, you can take reasonably good photos on site. I am so used to it, I can shoot a 300 page book in about an hour. When I want to share images on-line for example, I do a quick clean up with photoshop as one might do had they scanned from a book directly.
One might also consider purchasing some of the more expensive books that they would like to own but that they deem prohibitively too costly, and either photograph or scan them, and then resale them. Such books can then thus be had for little more than the price of postage.
You have a very impressive series of highly desirable books. Luckily you also live in a great city with a museum at your door stop! You must have quite a catalog of desired reference material on hand.
I completely agree with your views/post etc. Some really great references books can be very expensive. I recently purchased a copy of 'Chinese porcelain of the republic period' by Simon Kwan. An expensive book initially but a must have if you are interested in said period porcelain that can pay for itself. I recently was interested in a Wang Qi porcelain plaque. Beautifully done with a good hand. However upon closer examination by way of said book the calligraphy did not quite match up with known examples etc.
Mark
Hello Kaolin,
I think you have nailed it, and I think I am going to be a bit pourer in cash, but richer in ceramics in a few hours. I was told long ago that you may spend more on books than on pieces of art if you wish to collect (and I have spent a good deal on books so far) but your suggestion of using libraries is quite good (in Santa Fe where I live we have some good reference sources) .
Comments made earlier on the possibility of the piece being southeast asian (my opinion as well) are explained by the copying of Chinese forms (in my opinion often to good effect) by other Asian countries. Thank you, and thank you to all who have helped.
John
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