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Hi all,
I was actually able to go to view an auction, today - so nice to do that again! Anyway, as usual, I have come back with questions, if you don't mind helping, please.
There was this 12 inch vase there, on a stand. It has a daoguang mark but the rear side reminds me more of PROC although generally the landscape joins up. The girls' faces are also quite pretty and I recall Birgit mentioning that for PROC pieces, but on the other hand I can see slight similarity with Guangxu eyes, too, so all things considered I thought I would ask.
Thanks for your help!
Julia
ps The bats aren't very good.
The real give away is the flimsy/sloppy way the bat's are depicted. Glaze looks new! The design at the base is odd looking. Doesn't really fit with the rest imo.
Only buy for decorative value only. In other words if it's very cheap.
Mark
Thanks everyone.
Don't worry, I am not buying this one - it has quite a high estimate given they didn't date it. I was just suspicious about it, as I can see it is trying to be something but failing, I wasn't sure what it really was. I didn't like the bats not having faces or, and this is just me, there is something odd about the blue mark. I have felt that way before but I can never put my finger on what it is - the colour maybe? I don't know, seems a good warning though!
Also, I have just seen this, which seems to be a similar type and just adds to the "don't buy" feeling.
Thanks for your help. I have some more faces to show. For some reason, I seemed to take a lot of notice of them, today.
Julia
there is something odd about the blue mark. I have felt that way before but I can never put my finger on what it is - the colour maybe? I don't know, seems a good warning though!
I agree about the mark. It almost looks like it was printed rather than written.
Those figure look like they just stepped out of the puzzle house.
Below is a plaque from the later 20th century. Note the half white half tanned faces.
Mark
Julia, when you say you can’t put your finger on a certain point I think it’s because you have a good eye and the general impression that something is wrong with an item. This is a useful skill and better than arguing about single features of an item, trying to convince oneself and others that it’s not a fake. If it seems „somehow wrong“ it most probably is.
Birgit
@imperialfinegems. Maybe so but I still like that plaque of the book club.
Birgit, thank you and yes, you are right: if the general feeling is something is not right, then best to walk away even if you are not sure why you think that. 😊
Mark, those people look like aliens! 😆
Someone has misunderstood the „suntanned“ faces of late Qianlong.
Birgit
A further example of what a genuine late 19th century iron red facial expression looks like.
Note the clearly defined way the trees and butterflies are depicted. Even though the facial expression on the examples posted by Julia are good imo it's the other small details that are lacking.
From a distance and a quick glance one may be of the opinion that the vase was early PROC.
The following example is a plaque that bears the seal and mark of Wang Qi. He was a very famous member of the 'eight friends of zushan'. This particular image is a well-known representation and well sought-after example.
However this particular plaque is not by the hand of the master. It's a very good copy. The depiction of the demon and maiden even though done with exceptional skill still lacks the finer details especially with the facial features. Also the calligraphy and seal mark are not correct.
Still this particular example has been sold here in Australia a number of times ranging from about $1000 to $8000. It's currently back where it started about five years ago and is being sold today by Aalders auction. Estimate if I recall correctly is $650-850. It sold for $8000 when it first appeared on the market. Obviously the buyer found out it was a copy and dumped it. That cycle has repeated itself a number of times over the last five years or so.
Personally even though it is not original I still like it. Would probably still buy it for about $350.
By the way you have a good eye Julia!
Mark
Thank you! 😊
It interests me how a plaque like the one above can do the rounds as you describe. A little bit of research would reveal the price fluctuations during repeated sales and surely raise doubts.
Unless of course, buyers convince themselves that previous opinion was wrong? I suppose it only takes a couple of buyers to feel that way and then when they bid against each other for the piece, the fact that someone else is determined to have it, reinforces the idea that it is indeed worth paying a high price for.
Julia
@shinigami I think this is what Peter was talking about on the video about suntanned faces. I did not record how much I paid for this piece because if I remember correctly I bought it at Hero's (grocery store in Jakarta, although it may have been Ken Chick's grocery), so it was probably made about 1989/1990. I bought it to go on my patio and I do like the birds around the top, but the people look like they have a fever or they stayed in the fields too long without a hat. There is no mark anywhere identifying a factory, a country or anything else.
Hi Sharon, this is a printed version of the old rose mandarin pattern. I think your dating is correct.
Birgit
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