I think these all look pretty recent and nothing jumps out as high quality. The one that I find a little interesting is the enameled one, just because I like that type of look. It might be a little older and better than the others. Just my thoughts. Cheers!   John

Hi John,

Whilst I am not an expert on snuff bottles. I am always getting them wrong. 🤔

My inkling is that they appear to be fairly modern tourist type examples. I know Giovanni collects these so I do hope he replies with his thoughts.

Mark 

Hello, Mark, Johnshoe 

Thanks for responding, I know that the cloisonné is from late to early 19th to 20th century. I posted a site on cloisonné clouds sometime back that helps to date theses it has the ware and miner damaged to it. The smoke crystal I have not seen newer pieces mostly inside painted glass pieces that not hand painted,and modern resins pieces. That why I use the hot pin test and found out about nail polish removal test for cinnabar it works. I know my painted glass pieces are vintage but I like to about the writing on them. My camera is not the best for detail images but thanks for looking John

Dear John,

I am sorry to say that neither of your bottles are collectable items. The only one with a bit of interest is the inside painted amber glass one, i.e. the second bottle.

I would be really surprised if the first bottle is indeed smoky quartz, because of the type of painting, which is tourist grade.

The porcelain and the lacquered metal ones too are of that category.

The red one, looking lacquered, it is not a cinnabar bottle at all, regardless the tests. You can clearly see that it is not carved, it is molded.

Dear John, by your name you seem to be a native English speaker, but despite that I have some difficulty in understanding what you write. The meaning of the two following phrases are not clear to me: “I posted a site on cloisonné clouds sometime back that helps to date theses it has the ware and miner damaged to it. The smoke crystal I have not seen newer pieces mostly inside painted glass pieces that not hand painted,and modern resins pieces.”

Regards,

Giovanni

Hello,Giovanni 

Here a site for dating glass bottles and how they where made, they have section on Chinese glass. Little over a year ago on this form I posted a site on cloisonné pieces on how to date these bye the clouds Are you a member of the Chinese snuff bottles society.Have you heard of Peter Bentley he has a very nice collection all inside painted pieces he a member.here one that has same painted style. I basically gave up on this site because of your rudenest and how you treat members who disagree with you. John

https://sha.org/bottle/index.htm

John, I hope you know that I will go out of my way not to be rude. Maybe I am a coward but my usual inclination is to politely voice doubts and give reasons.

Regarding your metal snuff bottle, I have tried twice to find a nice way of saying it is very unlikely to be a late Qing piece, but as doubt had been voiced and I felt you may be feeling unhappy, I didn't post my comments.

Giovanni may sound brusque, but that doesn't mean he isn't right. It is very hard sometimes to tell someone they are wrong and come across in a nice way, especially if the person you are saying it to doesn't want to hear that view.

Many of us feel vulnerable if we post up our items, I feel equally vulnerable if I give an opinion. But opening ourselves up to what seems sometimes like criticism is how we all learn and move on. It isn't easy to cope with sometimes, but I imagine we have all been there and no doubt many of us will be on the wrong side of things, again.

Dear John,

once again I am not sure if I am understanding you correctly. You do not make a correct use of punctuation, capital letters, spacing, etc. Am I rude in saying that, or am I simply saying a fact?

Are you referring to myself in talking about rudeness? Please tell me if you found my previous message rude. I really do not see where. Because I said that the bottles are tourist items? How should have I said that, in your opinion? Dear John, your very beautiful bottles have been made for being sold to tourists? If so, sorry, I am not good for that, especially because in my opinion it is a wrong attitude.

I have a firm conviction that if I know nothing and I buy a trash item, the only good help that I could have for learning is if an experienced person will tell me that it is a trash item. That will sound as a strong advice, like “be careful, you are on the wrong path”. That is a real help, that will force me to understand what is wrong.

Instead if somebody will tell me that my nice item is not antique, it is a copy, and so on, as it often happens, what should I think, being a beginner? “Oh, it is not of the period, but he said that it is nice; not bad then”.

This would not help me.

But what I found interesting is that you said that I badly treat members that are not agreeing with me? That is really new. I will appreciate very much to see an example of that. Thank you.

BTW please tell me what you found rude in my message and how I should have expressed my opinion, in your view.

Dear Julia, you are very right. I myself do not always say the reasons for my opinions, because I do not think good to share some things on a public Forum. BTW by saying, for example, that John’s bottle imitating cinnabar lacquer is molded and not carved, I said the reason for my opinion. For example, if a fake famille verte vase is clearly not of the period because of the painting style, saying that is enough. It is not necessary to talk about the enamels, the faces, or else; if the “hand” is not there, it is all.

Yes, I knew Peter Bentley. He passed away last year. He had a big collection of very modern inside painted bottles, a genre of bottles that I do not like at all (am I rude?). But ha had also many good middle period IP bottles.

Regards,

Giovanni

@clayandbrush 

Hello.

Agreeing to disagree is a reasonable solution to any problem. Sometimes the need to be happy is as great as the need to be right.

Mike

Dear Mike,

please, please, tell clearly what you mean. I will not find you rude, be sure. For what you said, all that I could think is that I should have make John happy in telling him that his bottles are very fine. Is it that?

Should I have told him something wrong in order to make him happy?

Giovanni

I actually like it when these interpersonal aspects get addressed here on the forum. I think it keeps things real and is a good reminder of the human side of things. With that said, I have come to appreciate Giovanni's passion and direct approach. I don't think he is going out of his way to be rude, however I do think he is very honest about expressing his distaste for lower grade items. For a collector with a thin skin and high hopes for questionable items, this could lead to some challenging exchanges, however, you can choose to take it all with a grain of salt and see it as a learning experience. I can understand why people sometimes express disdain for things they deem fake/reproduction, etc. The more I learn the more I am starting to get that way too. I have enjoyed watching Peter literally get so disgusted at describing fakes during some of his videos he momentarily is almost speechless before he compares some hideous modern reproduction vase to something the cat puked up. For the more seasoned collectors, the tolerance for viewing such objects must diminish over time. At any rate, if you can learn to expect straightforward passion from these seasoned collectors then a great deal can be learned from them and a good deal of fun can be had here. Cheers!  John 

@julia Very, very well said Julia.  JT

Dear John (Johnshoe), very well said, thank you. I can’t express myself so well in English, but you said exactly what I think, and which is my approach.

In other words: I have the garage full of trash items which cannot be resold, as has almost every collector who started collecting at a certain point in his life (unless one has inherited a collection). What I really want, in calling low grade, and badly tasteful items with the proper name, is to try to avoid to others to fill their garage too.

Going further to be clearer: who can appreciate Art has not born with that good taste. He was taught, he studied, he refined his taste, backing it with competence. I won’t give what I kindly call a tourist snuff bottle to my granddaughter for her doll house; because one has to be trained toward the good taste.

Regards,

Giovanni

Hello, to all

Glass has a signature to it you look for as for when it was made. I agree knot everyone will agree with one another. Julia you have been very cautious,

and I don’t always use proper wording when writing on this site I’m sorry for that. 
I take what you tell me l will look in that direction so I do take what you all say but when it Doesn’t fit in I keep looking. I always appreciate the members help and there time. Inside painted glass bottles from what I read only started late 

19th century but the glass bottles they use was still being made he same ways 

Up to 1930 maybe little later, all so in 1936 Japan occupied a big part of China 

from what I have found on this if Chinese wanted too continue their trade it 

had to be under Japanese control and made too there style and standard.

on my cloisonné piece I should have posted pictures of bottom and how the 

lid was made. And all so for historical information Chinese civil war started in 1926 ended in 1950. The United States put a trade in bargo on China in 1950s

It ended in late 70s and shortly after they started putting China on pieces but in heavy red paint marks that disappear later and replaced with made in China inred stamp. For those who want to know, the middle 18th century Japan stopped alltrade and Japan imare pieces was hot to replace this market China started coping Japanese imare right down to the spur marks this can be found on Gothenburg site. I want to thank all for there help John

Dear John,

ok, so I am rude in your opinion, while in my opinion it is very unpolite to ignore others' questions. Different points of view, what to do.

What has to do all your previous post with bottles made in the last few years? If you do not believe that, try to list your bottles on eBay and see how much you will get from them, IF they will sell.

Regards,

Giovanni