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Hello everyone
i have just received this plate through the post from Ebay , it is a famille Rose European Subject plate, something just doesnt look right about this to me, ie there is not imperfections to the porcelain and the glaze just looks a little wrong/dull.
have you seen fakes of these type of Yongzheng plates? or i am i just being over cautious.
kind regards Steven
https://photos.app.goo.gl/UjbkU43cK96c9SND8
https://photos.app.goo.gl/iuQaEC7w5K83TTiC7
https://photos.app.goo.gl/pthK3pr3RnBYCjAF6
it would only let me upload that photo so the rest are links
Hi Steven,
by chance I was just yesterday looking at a Yongzheng plate with Europeans on it. It's offered by Guest and Gray, so it's surely authentic. Though it's imari and not famille rose, if you compare the faces of people you can see that the pink plate is most probably a fake. Also they painted the faces in a kind of late 19th century style that doesn't fit to the subject and the general decoration. My advice would be to return it to the seller, but there are more knowledgable people than me here that maybe can help you further.
Birgit
Hi Steven,
Peter Combs did an excellent video a while back about famille rose enamels, with a fair bit of advice on detecting the fakes.
~ Decorative Arts, Antiques and Accessories, at Mollari's ~ www.mollaris.com
Hello everyone
Thank you so much for replying and confirming what I thought.
The seller is denying the fact it is a modern Reproduction. Hopefully eBay will work in my favour.
That Video was fascinating ! Where on this website can I find the other videos ?
Kind regards Steven
Hello everyone
Thank you so much for replying and confirming what I thought.
The seller is denying the fact it is a modern Reproduction. Hopefully eBay will work in my favour.
That Video was fascinating ! Where on this website can I find the other videos ?
Kind regards Steven
Here you go: https://www.youtube.com/user/plcombs/videos
~ Decorative Arts, Antiques and Accessories, at Mollari's ~ www.mollaris.com
The first give away is the black. Black is the last colour the Chinese mastered. Be cautious of any Black from before the mid 1800's. The Black that does exist prior to that time, is actually very dark brown. Its made darker, when placed over another colour, like green for example. It is also very spare.
Next are the big long eyes - these appear on real items in the second half of the 1800's.
Lastly if you look at the glaze on the back, its just wrong. Its hard to explain how in words, but in person it will feel wrong. You should be able to see though the glaze to how the dry porcelain was carved away to make the foot rim, prior to glazing. All I see in yours is glaze that was applied using a spray gun.
Conclusion - not Yongzheng
ps, this is what a real Zongzheng plate looks like (compare the enamels)
That's a nice plate and clearly shows how beautiful Yongzheng enamels are. They are like jewels; whereas the ones on Steven's plate are muddy.
The plate submitted by Steven is a copy as many have already noted.
The enamels are much too opaque and lack almost any shading revealing those glowing colors of 18th C. originals. Further that very odd light lime green on the balustrade behind the figure is way off for old pieces. Lastly the drawing of the figures and other elements within the scene lack the fluidity found on old pieces.
By all means send it back, it shouldn't be any problem as the seller has to accept it back as it is "not as represented" if the listing claimed it as an 18th C. piece.
It almost looks like 20th C. Samson.
best Peter
Peter
Hello Everyone
i cant thank you all enough for the insight to your knowledge, i am Passionate about Asian Art but still have ALOT to learn,
Ebay have refunded me now and il be sending the plate back to the seller.
Michael M kindly posted the Video on Famille Rose Enamels, on the Video Peter mentions he will do another in depth one on Famille Verte but ive looked all over and cannot see it, id love to be able to see it if anyone could send me a link?
thanks again
Steven
Good to hear that you could return it, Steven. Feel free to ask here if you intend to buy something.
Birgit
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