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The BidAmount Asian Art Forum | Chinese Art

The Chinese and Asian Art Forum. For Fans, Collectors and Dealers.


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William Huvar
 William Huvar
(@william)
Noble Member
Joined: 5 years ago
Posts: 664
17/08/2021 10:38 am  

Late last night, I thought of something else that distinguishes the Chinese ceramic industry of the past versus the present day industry.  The effect of imperial patronage on the overall ceramic industry.  This was a ‘customer’ with enormous economic clout that was usually interested in top quality and imaginative artistic innovation.  The imperial household had the capacity to embed competent supervision in the field to drive improvements to benefit overall production.  By the early 20th century, that driving force was gone. I don’t think anything has ever filled that void over the past 120 years.


   
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Sharon P
 Sharon P
(@sharonp)
Illustrious Member
Joined: 5 years ago
Posts: 4522
17/08/2021 11:13 am  

It is all nebulous, similar to book collecting, age alone does not confer value but a limited special edition with fine illustration and binding will also command value. It reminds me of a friend, who thought the idea of antiques "creepy." He said, "I like new." I remember one of Peter's videos featuring the crooks in Georgia and it featured a yellow vase, as soon as it came up, it drew your eye and it was beautiful, which Peter admitted, it was just not what they represented it to be in their sale. When a tribute piece comes up on Antiques Roadshow, they are always swift to say it was not created at the end of the nineteenth to deceive but to pay homage but I do not think that was always true, you can be sure that some of it was misrepresented. A modern piece can command a high price for quality, certainly some Ming pieces are not quality pieces but age adds value for people who want the creep, to hold history in their hands. Sharon


   
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Greeno107
 Greeno107
(@greeno107)
Illustrious Member
Joined: 6 years ago
Posts: 2875
17/08/2021 11:40 am  

@sharonp Thank you, and I take no umbrage to you calling the vase a fake.

Clearly the maker had artistic talent to be able to make such a detailed and pretty vase.  And, the seller made no claim of it being antique - it was sold as a decorative vase.

However, regardless of the seller's intention, the design is bait, being used to lure an inexperienced buyer into buying it, or in my case, an experienced buyer who liked the quality of the vase enough to spend a few hundred dollars to own it for its artistic merits.

But, the vase will not increase in value, nor become collectible, because it has no artistic connection to the intangible elements that make art valuable.

 


   
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Greeno107
 Greeno107
(@greeno107)
Illustrious Member
Joined: 6 years ago
Posts: 2875
17/08/2021 11:43 am  

@shinigami Sorry for the misdirection of my response on my previous message. I some how put @sharonp in my response.  


   
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Brian Crowe
 Brian Crowe
(@lotusblack)
Illustrious Member
Joined: 4 years ago
Posts: 4241
Topic starter 17/08/2021 3:47 pm  

All masters have used the bait to make a piece capitalize. This has been debated and now has presidents. Andy Warhol. I don’t see how you can determine a piece will not be worth more or less art trends seen to push values. I have lots of art that 20 years ago was worth more and is now less. And the other way around. China economy could dictate this more or less. I think you are judging two separate categories Antique vs Art.  


   
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 Pactolus
(@pactolus)
Eminent Member
Joined: 7 years ago
Posts: 44
18/08/2021 11:41 am  

Interesting…

authentic porcelain pieces can be a store of wealth, which last (preserve in value) over time. Good reproduction porcelains are decorative, but a poor store of value. 


   
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Shinigami
 Shinigami
(@shinigami)
Illustrious Member
Joined: 7 years ago
Posts: 4863
18/08/2021 12:16 pm  

@pactolus Very true!

Birgit


   
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Topics and categories on  The BidAmount Asian Art Forum | Chinese Art

Kangxi vases, Kangxi dishes and chargers, Kangxi ritual pieces, Kangxi scholar's objects, Qianlong famille rose, Qianlong enamels, Qianlong period paintings, Qianlong Emporer's court, Fine porcelain of the Yongzheng period. Chinese imperial art, Ming porcelain including Jiajing, Wanli, Xuande, Chenghua as well as Ming jades and bronzes. 

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The BidAmount Asian Art Forum | Chinese Art

A free Asian art discussion board and Asian art message board for dealers and collectors of art and antiques from China, Japan, Korea, Thailand, Cambodia, Vietnam and the rest of Asia. Linked to all of the BidAmount Asian art reference areas, with videos from plcombs Asian Art and Bidamount on YouTube.  Sign up also for the weekly BidAmount newsletter and catalogs of active eBay listing of Chinese porcelain, bronze, jades, robes, and paintings. 

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