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John posted a black ships bowl with a Kotobuki mark recently. And another black ships small bowl with a scroll mark (although this scroll is a design, not a mark per-say...) I don’t know if the maker might be the same or not. Enamels look quite old and the designs are carefully painted. Any thoughts? Thanks, Todd
take it with a grain of salt
Hello Todd,
What a confusing world is the many mysteries of collecting Japanese ceramics. That large Kotobuki mark and it's cousin the large scrolls seems to turn up quite often but despite many searches can't seem to find any reliable reference to it. The marks in question remind me of some Gold Imari and Noritake marks but I can't find anything to confirm that. Very nice you have found a set of five bowls when I first looked at your photos I thought that the may be printed and hand filled but looking closer maybe they are entirely hand painted. The high foot rim and the fact the porcelain has little dimples or pit marks, and the phoenix's are painted with life and carefully shaded made me think early Meiji. However the blue to the outside looks like Wagner blue to my eyes so that if that is true it would preclude a pre 1870's date the fact the guiding on the outside is relatively unworn I think late Meiji or Taisho maybe closer to their date. Just some thoughts based on the photo's congratulation on find a nice set of five phoenix decorated bowls
Cheers
Michael
Hi Michael,
I had very similar thoughts. The painting quality and pitting make me think older. Also, the enamels have that look. But that blue on the outside gave me pause. And the gold decoration over the blue is not carefully drawn. And the gold Kotobuki reminds me of those Gold Imari marks as well. Always good to know we are seeing the same things, my friend. I did come across something interesting in the Saga Museum/John Coates link you provided not too long ago. Might these be lids? I am not saying these are of that age, but there are similarities 😋 . If these are lids, I am wondering what the bases look like. Those are very fancy phoenixes to hide in the shadows...
take it with a grain of salt
I agree with Michael! I really like your set of bowls, Todd. You always seem to find very interesting things.
On the marks, I don't think they're an indicator of age or a maker, but rather just another decorative element. That's how I'm looking at the Kotobuki mark due to the absence of any references otherwise. They're seen from the Edo period all the way to mid-20th century in my limited experience. I wouldn't be surprised if they are still being marked on the bottom of pieces today. I'll attach a photo of the mark on the bottom of my Edo period black ships bowl, and the mid-20th century fish plate I posted a while back. We could go back and forth on the stylistic differences between the two marks, but I don't think there's a large enough sample size to form any reliable conclusions.
Also, from what I've read, the Kotobuki mark means happiness, congratulations, or long life. The only exceptions to this mark not signifying origin are the Satsuma makers that include a Kotobuki character in their signatures, although that may be because of the way the character is pronounced rather than its meaning. See Juzan on the satsuma marks page 36.
Thanks for the information, John. So, the Kotobuki is best looked at as a decoration, I think you are right. Its in the spot that the mark usually occupies, but that doesn’t necessarily make it any different from other decorations. And it seems to indicate no specific maker, so its a good rule. I really like that fish, by the way!
I emailed John Coates and he replied with an opinion of late Edo, with a possibility of late 18th. Likely not directly related to the early Arita lids in the picture above. The form is not a match for the lids, so these are probably stand-alone dishes.
take it with a grain of salt
Hello Todd,
That good news !
Michael
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