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Hi,
Please can you have a look at this and see what you think of the faces. I have been trying to date it and I am just going round in circles!
It was described as early 20th c. I thought it might be 1920/30s but I am not sure. It is very messily done - in that aspect it reminds me of those 19th /20th c plates that have people's initials scratched into them. The colours make me think of those as well. On this item, the pale green has crazed in patches and there is an oily sheen that has only shown up in the photos.
Also, what are those red things on the heads of some of the people (see the person on the Qilin and the child (?) in the photo before that) are they meant to be hats?
I hope this loads ok, for some reason we have a struggling wifi connection today! 😊
Thanks for looking!
Julia
Hi Julia, stay away from this. The painting looks pseudo Guangxu to me. It’s downright ugly if you enlarge the faces of the two riders. Tommy Eklöf shows faces from fakes in the last pages of the book, some look similar to this vase. The red things on the head are an awful rendering of a Guangxu cap.
Birgit
Thanks, Birgit, I knew I could rely on you! 🤗 It is mine, I am still going through a job lot and I need to get rid of it, but wanted to do so honestly. I was really struggling seeing it as early 20th and kept pushing the date towards the other end but failed to find anything there that compared..
You can't see it in the picture, but the inside is bad, too. Yes, those faces are awful - and the hats! No wonder the auctioneer sneaked it into a larger lot! 😉
I will stick it on ebay in the correct category, correctly described and invite bids. If it doesn't sell I will take it to a charity shop.
Thanks for your help. 😊
Julia:
This is a terrible piece if one looks at the details. I doubt that the period from which it derives is of any importance. I'm sure that even in the Kangxi period awful work was done. Also, I doubt that it is correct to describe it as Gu shaped.
Errol
Hi Julia:
I did not realize that you owned this vase and that you acquired it as part of a lot. My comments were not intended to be offensive and I think you and Birgit both agree that it has a lot of defects. I rethought the issue of what a Gu-shape is. I think you were correct in describing the vase as Gu-shaped. I looked it up again and a Gu is tall and slender vessel with a slightly flared base that tapers to a slim center section before widening again into a trumpet-like mouth, wider than the base. I had for some reason thought that a central bulge was needed as in the Clair-de-Lune vase I use next to my name here (see photograph below). However, I was wrong about that and I apologize.
Best regards,
Errol
A product of the later part of the 20th century. Sloppy painting style trying to encampture a guangxu style. It fails!
Mark
@imperialfinegems Well, it probably kept the family fed, as we used to pitch in art class, it has a naive quality and it shows a joie de vive of loose brush strokes and not a small amount of social dissonance (not to mention physical dexterity at juggling babies and riding at the same time). 🤣
Thanks for making me laugh this morning. 😊
I am not offended in the least. Especially as I have been having to bid without even seeing some things and unless I really like something, I never spend much money. Sure, had I seen this in person, I would not have bought it, it is a mess; but there are good mixed lots around, it is simply that very often there is a whole load of junk with the piece you want, junk which I actually enjoy examining sometimes.
This piece puzzled me, I could see it was trying to be Guangxu but I knew it wasn't. I could also see it wasn't trying to deceive the kind of buyers that fakers try to deceive. So you have to wonder why it was made, well I do because social history interests me. It can only have been a low value item, probably produced for people with a small disposable income - perhaps tourists looking for souvenirs. As Sharon said, although this is a poor item, this kind of work does feed families. I find all that interesting.
Anyway, thanks for the apology, Erroll, but please don't worry. I am glad you did though: it is a good reminder that sometimes messages can come over badly, even unintentionally.
It’s a low grade fake. As there are different grades of knowledge with the buyers there are different grades of fakes. Somehow they all find their appropriate buyers, as someone had obviously imported this into Europe.
Fakers love unglazed bottoms because by now they know that glazed bottoms wrongly done are one of the easiest ways to detect a fake.
As you noted they used the right colors for the time.
All that makes me think of a rather recent copy, not an awkward 1980s one.
Birgit
Hello,
Just a thought a few years ago on this forum we discussed a plate that was decorated in a similar way to this vase. One of the poster replied with a link with information regarding a School for young ladies in Shanghai that taught China painting, poetry, flower arranging. For memory the School dated from the late 19thc until about 1930. There were some photo's showing works of very varying abilities. It seems that in common with the west that the ladies that do lunch had lots of time on their hands and Schools like this were a socially acceptable way for them to spend their time. Not suggesting Julia's vase should be counted as a product of this School just saying not all poorly painted items are fakes.
Cheers
Michael
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