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Hey Folks,
Been a minute....
Recently got a nice little figure, tested at 2.95-3 specific gravity so probably nephrite, of Liu Haichan(I think).... I am terrible with dating these, but it seems quite well carved a little sloppy on a few cuts but very detailed.... Kind of thinking late Qing. Wondering what you all thought.
Just want to make sure I list it properly.
Cheers,
Jeremy
@jbeer2121 Joan Hartman wrote:
One can write reams on dating jade. There comes a time, though when words are sperfluous. For art is a personal, highly emotional quantity. Pick up a piece of jade. Observe its detail. Feel its surface quality. Examine the material under a light. Put it down and come back to it another day. Continue to examine and handle other jade carvings. Notice the subtle differences in material, carving, polish, subject matter. The appreciation grows upon you. It is only by handling jade over and over again that one acquires an instictive knowledge of the art, an awareness of style and form and finish which enables one to place the item within a certain period of Chinese history. There are no rigid rules to follow. We can only view the contrasts in workmanship very broadly, and make a carefully considered calculated guess."
Chinese Jade of Five Centuries, Joan M. Hartman, Charles E. Tuttle Company, Inc., 1969 p.34
Elsewhere she wrote, to paraphrase, "Jadeite did not arrive in China from Burma in great quantity until the end of the 18th century and it was predominately used for hair ornaments and jewelry, the large sculptural pieces of jadeite were later periods." Also, that most experts are hesitant to date jade without handling and study, which our member Mark has mentioned many times how difficult if not impossible it is to date jade from photographs. It was also interesting to me that even the earlier ones were produced in a type of assembly line, one guy would be the best polisher etc., so it was not one lonely guy from start to finish and only about 3 guys from this early period who actually signed their work.
Given all this, those with pieces you think worthy, may wish to take it somewhere to be evaluated. Sharon
Hi Jeremy,
From your pictures I believe that in high probability that it's nephrite jade.
The carving is nicely done with good polish. The colour is desirable.
As to age imo I think probably around second half of the 20th Century.
It could be Republic period as I am having trouble with enlarging the images without them blurring.
Mark
Hi Jeremy,
I managed to put your carving on to a 70" screen.
The details are lacking especially around the facial areas.
I can see what looks like modern tooling.
As electric tooling was used to carve jade from about the later Republican period but more so during the 50's and 60's onwards.
If you were to sell it I would simply describe it as possibly 20th Century.
Mark
Thanks Sharon,
Ill have to get that book.... thanks for sharing the excerpt..
I ave a few other pieces I've posted a while ago that are earlier but also one that is beautifully carved( one not so well done... but the stone is gorgeous). Funny thing is I really like the stone of this one too, carving aside.
Cheers,
Jeremy
P.S. Hopping on a plane in a few hours bound your way. Looking forward to the Texas mid-80s over the Maryland 50s....
Hi Jeremy,
The hue of the carving you posted is beautiful and with a excellent polish.
Dating jade's by pictures alone is a difficult task at times. Especially white jade.
As the late Sam Bernstein (renowned dealer from San Francisco) once quoted. You can show a jade carving to 6 dealers/collectors and get 12 different opinions.
Mark
Thanks Mark,
See I'm glad I asked.... Clearly not my area still.
I grabbed my good 40x microscope lens and definitely see what you mean on the tooling, oddly it doesn't seem chipped too much just the rotary type of cuts are really noticeable. Just from presumably a lower speed tool?
Also Im wondering, I saw a post on Gotheborg about rotary tools used starting in the late 1870s, curious if there's a way to differentiate the more modern ones and those earlier ones? Also i swear some of the ones I looked at that were late Qing( or sold as that) at the majors had similar tooling using the zoom feature. mostly on toggles and small immortal figures.... I guess thats what left me with my initial thoughts ont he dating.... but Im probably just missing something.
Curious what screen you are using, I would love to put pieces on such a large screen especially before buying on-line.
I will just list it as 20th century... though I may keep it on my desk for a while, I really love the stone.
Thanks again,
Jeremy
You were typing while I was.... I find white jade to be my favorite stone, its just beautiful in different lighting.... but my god is it hard to judge, and super hard to photograph..
now off to the airport.
Jeremy
Hi Jeremy,
I hope that I successfully uploaded a G.I.A on carving techniques for jade.
Primarily speaking electric drilling did not appear until the 50's/60's. Prior to this was peddling foot techniques.
Often with high speed drilling you will see chipping on either side but these can be polished out so difficult to see.
Perfect circles and curves are another give away but this needs to studied in depth before one makes assessment.
Stuttered or jumping lines.
Overshooting lines... However one needs to take everything else into consideration as some old carving do have this feature.
Incomplete or lacking fine details that you would see on a old carving. Not including Neolithic or warring states jades.
The polish is different from new versus old carvings
Mark
A 19/20th Century white jade dragon and Chilong buckle that arrived yesterday.
Nice even hue of white jade. 9.3 cm long.
Always difficult to photograph white jade. Here it is next to a large example of Greyish-white nephrite.
Mark
Very nice buckle you got Mark, as Sharon has stated jade is a hands on subject and i would go with Mark has to say he right on. John S.
Hey Mark,
First of all sorry it took me so long to hop back on here, came back from Texas with a mean sinus infection(note to anyone visiting central Texas in the spring, if you are allergic to any tree on earth you will die... lol) and was like I'll read that pdf tomorrow.... welp it took me a few weeks for tomorrow to come.
Thanks for posting both the PDF and explanation, and your lovely buckles...
Having looked it over and compared it to my other pieces which are republic and late Qing I can clearly see a difference, but I must say this just seems to not be my area of understanding. I mean obviously those ones from the GIA pdf are spectacular, I love love love the Xi Jiang one that looks like a sheet of crumpled paper, and obviously if I came across that i would think new, but spectacular, but others I just don't know. Now Potting and glaze and painting I can grasp, or at least see the characteristics and holding a nice tea bowl in my hands I can usually get a feel for it. I've handled a bunch of jades and seen some good ones and nope, nothing. Still like em though haha.
So thank you for at least giving me the info and all your help.
Cheers,
Jeremy
oh and by the way I found this site with modern jades, some of which are just amazing....
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