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Hello knowledgeable ones,
I found this 12cm wide by 4.3cm tall bowl recently and had to buy it to learn. Thought it was a brown treated rim when I bought it, but it’s actually a metal rim. Assuming a reproduction when I first saw it, then turned it over and saw the incised lines and thought I’d get it and ask the experts. I should stop writing because I have no clue. Thanks for your thoughts. It is hand turned. Hopefully that can be seen. There is one closeup.
It might be useful to see the inferior, too, please. 😊
Sorry Julia, I thought the inside might be seen in the first photo. One photo is in the sunlight the other in shade, which is closer to the color, I believe.
Hi CP -
From the images, this appears to lack certain features seen on authentic Ding wares, especially the exterior glaze, footrim and base …
Ding pieces are exceptionally light in comparison to their size when handled. How does this dish compare? …
Stuart
@ming1449 I don’t have much to compare it with, but I’ll compare it to a 1925 (says Peter) bowl when I get home later tonight. It’s definitely not like the featherweight items coming out these days. How do they make these rims? I can’t even find a seem where it may have been joined. Thanks for your response.
@centralpapottery Definitely not Ding but it looks maybe Song to Yuan. It's a cool old bowl. Love the metal rim. Jeremy would know more if he peeks in. John
My circa 1925 bowl (Peter’s date) is 12.3 wide 5.7 tall 140 grams
This bowl is 12cm wide 4.5cm tall 162 grams.
@johnshoe thanks John. Hopefully Jeremy will peek in. It looked old and I just couldn’t figure why imitators would add those lines on the back causing the glaze to be a little thicker, but I definitely was not/am not sure it’s authentically old. I know fakers go to extraordinary lengths.
@julia I also had considered those same options, as I have two pieces of each type that have some resemblances to this bowl. But regardless I don't have any doubts about it being old.
Hi CP -
Such metal rims, or lip bands, were fitted due mouth rims having to be wiped free of glaze because of the stacking process used during firing at the Ding kilns …
Metal bands affixed to most ceramics including those on Ding pieces, were relatively often measuring up to two centimetres both on the interior and exterior …
In most cases, the narrow bands seen on Song ceramics today were added in the 19th or 20th century as replacements for the lost or damaged originals …
My apologies, but I do not have the knowledge to say how these bands were fitted …
Stuart
@ming1449 thank you, Stuart. I did read that somewhere. The Christie’s examples I’ve seen from the Song/Ming dynasties seem to look like mine. The rim on their item from 8 Nov 2016, A Moulded Ding Bowl looks almost exactly like mine. I agree, how they fitted it is just amazing. It’s almost like they dipped it perfectly in hot metal/copper and let it cool on the rim without it running. I can’t feel or see any seem.
Anyway, hopefully I’ll find a similar example somewhere. If not, that’s not good. By the way, my metal rim is only 6mm wide from inside to outside edge of the metal.
Thanks again for taking the time to respond.
@centralpapottery Like Stuart said, the wider metal bands are usually the ones that were applied longer ago. I have some pieces with thinner ones on them. Like you I am still baffled as to how these were put on so perfectly. And as you said there does not appear to be a seam which seems impossible but somehow they did it. If anyone here has more info please share it because I'd love to know how it was accomplished.
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Bonhams Fine Art Auctioneers & Valuers: auctioneers of art, pictures, collectables and motor cars. We use cookies to remember choices you make on functionality and personal features to enhance your experience to our site. By continuing to use our site you consent to the use of cookies. ... Chinese Art (US) General enquiries
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Bonhams are international auctioneers of fine Chinese and Japanese art. We specialise in rare Imperial and Export Chinese ceramics and works of art, as well as Japanese ceramics, fine and decorative works of art from the Neolithic Period to the 20th century. View on map
Bonhams Fine Art Auctioneers & Valuers: auctioneers of art, pictures, collectables and motor cars. We use cookies to remember choices you make on functionality and personal features to enhance your experience to our site. By continuing to use our site you consent to the use of cookies. ... Asian Art Bonhams. Work. 22 Queen St.