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I picked up this small vase a couple of weeks ago. It has relief (anhua?) decoration featuring a bat and what looks like a chilong / chimera, climbing around on lingzhi / ru-heads. It has an inscribed 6-character kaishu Qianlong mark at the bottom (there was only a vertical example of this mark in Davison's book, not a horizontal one). The glaze is white and has a fair amount of orange peel (but not much in the lower part where the glaze has piled a little before the foot). It is 18.5cm in height and fairly thinly potted. Footrim is smooth compact paste, with thin iron oxide lines both inside and outside the rim. As can be seen in the pictures, it has a larger damaged/repaired area on the rim, as well as a small chip on the foot rim.
Could this be mark and period, or? Thank you for any opinions.
P.S. I hate to say it, but I think the image compression plugin the site uses on uploaded pictures is a bit to aggressive. I have also uploaded the pictures here, in case someone needs more detail: https://postimg.cc/gallery/s21Sc93
Your piece looks very similar to a small vase (4 1/2”) that I purchased from a dealer in Amsterdam in the 90’s. It was sold to me as Yongzheng. I think your piece has a good chance of being 18th century though I haven’t seen a mark like that before.
Your piece looks very similar to a small vase (4 1/2”) that I purchased from a dealer in Amsterdam in the 90’s. It was sold to me as Yongzheng. I think your piece has a good chance of being 18th century though I haven’t seen a mark like that before.
Here is mine for comparison.
I have searched high and low for a similar example (both the shape of the vase as well as the way the mark is written), but no luck at all. According to gotheborg.com, the kaishu version of the Qianlong mark was only used for a couple of years after Yongzheng, before a decree made the zhuanshu seal mark standard. Does your vase also have an almost orange peel feel to the white glaze?
~ Decorative Arts, Antiques and Accessories, at Mollari's ~ www.mollaris.com
Mine does have a slight orange peel effect and a fine crackle under 10x loop. Foot rim is somewhat V shaped.
I have looked with the strongest loop I have, there is no sign of crackle.
How translucent is yours? Mine is fairly translucent all over the body, except for the bottom. The bottom seems to be much thicker than the rest of the vase.
~ Decorative Arts, Antiques and Accessories, at Mollari's ~ www.mollaris.com
My piece is not particularly translucent. The color is more creamy white than pure white. There is also a lot of detail in the incised decorations of flowers & leafy vines.
I notice the little ‘flame like’ designs around the top & bottom of the vase actually vary slightly in height in an alternating pattern. What strikes me is the surprising amount of detail on a small vase that at first glance looks simple & somewhat plain.
Concur with @springmeier, the design execution, overall quality and especially the writing of the mark all indicate a much later date - certainly note Qianlong m/p ...
You are quit correct, the six-character kaishu mark was used only in the first 2/3 years before been replace, authentic examples are extremely rare ...
The few genuine pieces I have seen are always written in underglazed blue comprising three characters in two vertical lines enclosed by a double circle ...
Concur with @springmeier, the design execution, overall quality and especially the writing of the mark all indicate a much later date - certainly note Qianlong m/p ...
You are quit correct, the six-character kaishu mark was used only in the first 2/3 years before been replace, authentic examples are extremely rare ...
The few genuine pieces I have seen are always written in underglazed blue comprising three characters in two vertical lines enclosed by a double circle ...
Stuart
That is why I asked. But I do strongly disagree with springmeier concerning the dating to late 20th century.
That said, I am not seeing the lack of quality in design, nor in either the shape of the vase, nor the glaze, I would love to hear more about what you base that on, because I am not seeing it. The glaze is delicate, the orange peel was a decoration choice, not an accident because of lack of ability (orange peel / chicken skin was something that was done to some monochromes at this time on purpose, I assume to give them a fatty appearance, at least that it was it says on gotheborg). It also mentiones that marks in this period, can be incised, although I have not found examples that have been, those I have seen have all been, what I assume to be, impressed zhuanshu marks, who of course don't have the circles.
But I think we can probably agree that monochromes can be a nightmare to date in some cases, and there aren't a hell of alot of white wares from this period that I have been able to look at for comparison, either in reference works that I have access to or on the major auction house sites (let alone ones with pictures of their footrims and marks). Since the design was probably molded rather than carved, I can only hope that I stumble upon a similar example of decoration that might be easier to date.
Anyway... the main reason I want to know what I have here, is that in case it is crap, it would be wasted to have it professionally restored. :/
~ Decorative Arts, Antiques and Accessories, at Mollari's ~ www.mollaris.com
William's vase look correct for the 18th century but yours do not. I have a little bit of experience with 18thC white glaze molded ware so I will try to explain why I think your vase is from the late 20th century.
1. The overall composition is incorrect for this type of ware. The size of each elements (bat, lingzhi, dragon) is unbalanced. The dragon is also not done in any classical manner and not possible on an antique chinese piece.
2. This mark is impossible for a Qianlong mark and period vase. As far as I know, the only antique 6 character horizontal kaishu Qianlong marks that are not within a double circle are written in blue and date to the 19th century. The large size of the mark in proportion to the base also strongly suggests a late 20th C. production date.
3. Like one William's piece, such non-imperial white glaze molded ware are usually fired at low temperature and are what you call "soft paste" porcelain. It results in a fine crackled glaze visible throughout the body and have an eggshell thickness. I can't see any of it on your piece.
William's vase look correct for the 18th century but yours do not. I have a little bit of experience with 18thC white glaze molded ware so I will try to explain why I think your vase is from the late 20th century.
1. The overall composition is incorrect for this type of ware. The size of each elements (bat, lingzhi, dragon) is unbalanced. The dragon is also not done in any classical manner and not possible on an antique chinese piece.
2. This mark is impossible for a Qianlong mark and period vase. As far as I know, the only antique 6 character horizontal kaishu Qianlong marks that are not within a double circle are written in blue and date to the 19th century. The large size of the mark in proportion to the base also strongly suggests a late 20th C. production date.
3. Like one William's piece, such non-imperial white glaze molded ware are usually fired at low temperature and are what you call "soft paste" porcelain. It results in a fine crackled glaze visible throughout the body and have an eggshell thickness. I can't see any of it on your piece.
1. You're right about the dragon, because as I already mentioned, it is not a dragon. It is either a chimera or a chilong (I am leaning more towards the chilong).
2. Well, the base isn't very wide, and I do not think it looks crammed in there. And it might indeed be later.
3. Well, this isn't "soft paste", in my opinion, and from what I gather from Nigel Woods book, at least some white glazes are fired at high temperature, and the crazing / crackle is either done deliberately, or because there is a problem with the glaze on the body. If you search on white wares from some of the major auction houses, not all white wares have crackle. However, it is thin enough that light can shine through, but I don't think this would qualify as egg shell porcelain.
~ Decorative Arts, Antiques and Accessories, at Mollari's ~ www.mollaris.com
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Basic Rules For the BidAmount Asian Art Forum: Talk about whatever you want. You can even discuss and offer things that are for sale if they are authentic. Maximum image file size per post is 2 MB. Images of 700pxl x 700pxl are optimal if saved at a medium resolution. Be respectful of others and enjoy yourself. Click the YouTube link for a brief tutorial on using the forum. You can also EMBED Videos by cutting and pasting from You-Tube, Vimeo etc. 
