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Hello, everyone! I came across this mandarin vase which I thought was quite unusual. I am almost certain it looks right for 19th century, but wanted to get the thoughts of this group!
Appears new to me. Clues are overly decorated with gold and every possible space filled with decoration lacks subtlety. Have a problem with green dragons inside of upper rim it’s as if it is reaching out and saying “buy me please.” Haven’t seen such an example in the many late 19th vases I have seen. Let’s see what others have to say.
George
Wow, what a strange vase. I see why George is not convinced, but it is a good one to me.
The gilded areas are absolutely strange, as are the dragons, hence George's perplexities.
But the panels with the personages are ok, and even may be late 18th or early 19th century.
Could it have been clobbered?
Regards,
Giovanni
The people look absolutely ok for 1840 in my opinion. Maybe the gold and the dragons were added later in the century.
Birgit
What an interesting vase! How big is it? I love the shape of the mouth: the way it flares upwards and inwards rather than down and outwards.
That gilding really is amazingly bright and pristine looking for 19th c, especially as other bits don't look as pristine yet one would expect the gilding to be most vulnerable.
I also agree that the dragons seem rather incongruous - as though it was decided to squeeze in another Chinese motif somewhere. Not sure I find the bottom border sympathetic to the overall design, either, however, having said all that, the rest does look 19th c but I am not entirely convinced. I did wonder if it was republic but I am equally unconvinced about that!
The base is very messy. Is it unglazed?
That’s what is great about this forum everyone willing to be polite and friendly even when disagreements arise.
OK, not 100% in agreement, but if it is 19th century it is rare and commands a premium price
George
I think this is an amazing vase, just look at the way the butterfly is drawn on the neck , and the panels of people are incredibly detailed and fine; facial features, hair etc . and those gilded side panels with all the objects.
I agree with Shinigami this looks right for the mid C19th canton export but of exceptional and rare quality; you should check carefully whether there has been restoration , eg of the gilded parts, but a very nice find!
tam
My goodness that is huge! It might well explain why the gilding is still so good - it is too big to be handled frequently. That would overcome my real objection to a 19th c date. I'd also rather see a messy unglazed base than a glazed one.
Assuming I could afford it, my feeling is that I would rather buy this than spend ages afterwards wishing I had!
Hi dragonfly34 -
Not really my area so I will defer to those above but, from the images, this appears to be quite an impressive piece, highly detailed and finely painted.
I would agree with the concerns expressed in regard to the very dense overall designs, the dragons to the inside rim which seem rather disproportionately drawn with very short/stumpy legs, and areas of gilding, which display little/no signs of wear.
If you are thinking of acquiring I would concur with Tam’s comments - check very carefully for any signs of restoration and latter, additional decoration.
Stuart
I continue thinking that the vase has been clobbered.
The reasons are many.
The gold is too much bright.
The butterfly has not been made by a Chinese. You can laugh, but the reason is that I pay much attention to butterflies on Chinese ware and I have never found a butterfly that is portraying a real one. All them are fantasy butterflies. Instead here we have a butterfly of the genre Papilio.
The fruits and flowers too are not Chinese. Have you never seen a pair of Buddha’s hands on a branch, like here? I never. And what about the yellow flower on the same branch with pink buds?
Note also that all the flowers and fruits have the same type of leaves. That is not possible in Chinese iconography.
The dragons are not Chinese at all, everything of them is out.
Instead, the decoration within the panels is, as said, of very good quality (and Chinese).
I personally would not buy, but that is me, because I hate clobbered porcelain. But is no doubt a very nice vase and worth to buy if one is not allergic to clobbered ware.
Regards,
Giovanni
This vase has a lot of mixed patterns. I've not seen this lot in one place previously.
My guess - End of Qing, or thereafter (ie end of guangxu or thereafter). Circa 1920's - 50's.
The five toe dragons on the inside of the rim, suggests this vase was made when the decorator was not fearful of putting a five toed dragon on a vase not intended for the Imperial Collection. A number of those faces look Republic.
This went for $1,000 at auction! I thought you guys might appreciate the update.
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