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Hi All,
I found this famille rose vase a few weeks ago at a thrift store. It has a nice precious objects pattern, with minor enamel loss. It as hand-marked "CHINA" on the bottom, I know that mark, somewhat unreliably, indicates it is from the period of roughly 1890-1920. Is it really from that period, or is it a modern copy? The enamel looks good to me, but I am a beginner. Does it have any value? I didn't pay much, but am curious if I made a good deal.
Thanks,
Charles
@Charles Bryan,
You have a very beautiful vase that you picked up at the thrift store.
In my opinion based on your pictures it is from the Republic period 1912-1949. The border at the lip and base are unusual for the period. It is hand painted. Based on the overall look and paste I am confident that it is from said period.
You are correct with the period that the 'CHINA' was used. However there are numerous examples of said being used right up to the 1970's or so. Copies made in China today also bear this mark on some examples. However yours imo is not one the them.
Could you confirm the size and if it has any damage/other?
Mark
Hi Mark,
Thanks for the information! The vase is 10.25" high. The only damage is some missing enamel. You can see this in the photos-- some missing blue enamel from the pendant on the right side of the vase (calling the large image the front), and a little more missing blue enamel from the ribbons on the back of the vase. I did not include a picture of the upper rim, but it is perfect.
I am glad this one is not modern. After making a few expensive mistakes, I am restricting myself to thrift-store finds, until I learn more...
@kirby13 Don't worry, you aren't alone in the "expensive mistakes" category. To give you a clue as to the nature of mine, I now travel everywhere with a lighter and a sharp pin in case I happen to run into any other "cinnabar" vases. Well, we can look at these things as tuition - probably something everyone goes through to some extent. The good news is we have bidamount to help us find the way. Cheers and happy searching!
This , to me , does not look Republican in style, more like PROC, possibly 1960s or 1970s, but I am not sure. The decorative style is copying C18th famille rose vases, and these kind of copies were not made or hardly made in the Republican period.
The footrim is inconclusive for dating, imo, but the base is quite unusual being very smooth and concave. The potting is possibly done in a mould rather than hand -thrown - can you see any evidence of this inside the vase (a vertical seam or similar?)
tam
Hi, All. Here are a few more pictures. The inside of the base has no vertical seam. There is a shrinkage crack around the base on the inside, suggesting that it was added--I don't know whether that would be consistent with the vase being molded. I think it looks hand-thrown, as there are faint horizontal lines on the vase, visible in glancing light.
Charles
I thought the word China looked odd, the letter sizes are usually more regular but maybe that is because this is handwritten?
I wondered about 1970s but it isn't very glossy or shiny and the enamels are quite heavy looking. I also thought the base was concave but looking closely it doesn't seem to be. A clearer picture might help, as the white has blurred the details.
Could it be early republic? I mean around 1920? I find the word China is so nicely written that I can't imagine this belongs to a time of mass-production unless it is a deliberate fake, but why write China when a reign mark may fool more people - unless it is a kind of double bluff?
When I first viewed this my initial thoughts were that it was a fairly modern copy.
However when I took a closer look i felt that it was probably Republic period or early PROC at the latest. The hard and soft pink are visible on the peonies/other. Although the shading is not convincing for high quality. There are no distinct hard black or soft black present on this example due primarily to the style or design etc. Problematic in trying to determine age based on other factors.
Tam18 is correct in my opinion. These types of styles were made during the 18th century. Examples are also known right through to the Guangxu period. Late 19th century especially seen with that type of border etc. However as already suggested I have not seen any examples from the Republic period that match your vase. That does not mean that they were not made during that period. Just that I have not seen one until now.
The China mark is hand-drawn and not printed. Another good sign in my opinion.
As noted by Julia the glaze is not shiny and nor is it a suger-white as seen ever so much from the 1970's onwards. In my opinion the glaze is consistent with a wood kiln and not the gas kiln seen in ever increasing kilns from the 1960's. Wood kilns were used right up to the 1980'S. From my reading and understanding they were outlawed in the 1990's. Just to muddy the waters further there have been reports that wood kilns are currently being used in secret locations in order to replicate old glaze.
This example posted is a great discussion piece because it mixes guangxu and early republic periods along with possible later PROC.
It's worth pointing out that rose famille of the 1950's and 60's were generally characterized by two features. New subject matter related to the change after the 1949 revolution and the subsequent new society as well as realistic depictions of daily life. Old potters and artists shifted their themes from traditional ones to these two catagories. This example is clearly based on earlier themes.
The glaze is in my opinion fired in a wood kiln and not gas. Old kiln fired by wood leaves a distinctive look and appeal that cannot be replicated in a gas furnace in my opinion. The glaze on said example appears to be ever so slightly rippled indicating a presence of hand work etc. This can be seen by the additional pictures posted.
It may be a good idea to ask Peter's thoughts on it for $10. There is also a good video Peter posted awhile ago on Republic period porcelain.
It's my submission that this vase is probably late Republic period. Perhaps early PROC. So 1946-1950's. On much later examples from the 70's the border is often printed. Yous is hand drawn etc.
This is an example sold by heritage auctions and described as republic period. The border at the lip and base are very loosely like your vase.
Just my thoughts. 😊
Mark
@imperialfinegems Good thouhts Mark, not much to add except that it does not have marks like my sixties or seventies pieces. Maybe it is transitional from late Republic/early PROC? It will now cost you 12.00 for the evaluation and it is a bargain to just satisfy your curiosity, even if it turns out to have decorative value only, that value will be more than you paid. I like your vase with the precious objects and would count myself lucky to come across one similar in quality at a charity/thift shop. Enjoy, Sharon
Thanks, All. Peter agreed--late Republic to early PROC.
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