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This seller labeled this as Chinese. Looks more Japanese to me. Does it have age? Looks a bit glossy. But then the foot does have some kiln grit. I really don’t know what to make of it. Early 20th, Japanese? A more recent copy? Thanks, Todd
take it with a grain of salt
Hi Todd -
Certainly not Chinese - looks Japanese (or possible Korean) to me? ...
As to age, the images appear to indicate very little glaze surface ware, but I will defer to the Japanese specialist here ..?1🤔...
Stuart
I have noticed this seller before. Has sold 63.000 items but declares „I’m not familiar with foreign antiques. So I do not know the correct age of this item.“ He could as well admit that his stuff is still hot from the kiln. I think the kendi is indeed made in China as are all the other Japanese or Korean items he sells.
Birgit
I have to go out on a limb and defend this seller...up to a point. The items they describe as non-Japanese, I agree, buyer beware. But for the Japanese items, which are the large majority, I think they are described mostly accurately. I have the greatest respect for Birgit and Julia...they know that. I hate to disagree with either of you at all 😋 . Just as a note...here in Thailand, my last order from Japan was levied a 40% customs charge, on an antique. Something akin to a shakedown.
take it with a grain of salt
Why would you write/think that Julia? A lot of dealers offer lower declaration etc. Actually if an item is over $1000 I insist on a lower declaration otherwise I have to pay an additional $400+.
Whereas if under $1000 I only pay 10% flat as automated by eBay at the checkout on behalf of Australian tax office.
Too suggests that lower declaration is somehow associated with fake/other goods is erroneous and misleading imo. Sorry julia!
Every cent helps!
Mark
Sorry, Mark. I usually see comments to the contrary ie don't ask me to lower the sale price on the invoice. I was astonished that anyone would openly flag up that one is offering to bypass the system. I thought tax evasion was frowned upon (I can be very naive!). Yes, of course, I know it goes on (no need for the "don't ask me ..." comments otherwise), but I was so surprised that a seller would advertise it.
In my defence, I didn't actually say that I associate offers to write lower prices with fake/dodgy goods. One thing doesn't necessarily follow from the other at all and I am sorry if either of you thought I was deliberately implying that. We were just talking about one seller, maybe it came over badly. What I actually was thinking was that s/he was very confident that if customs opened one of their packages there was no way they were going to be suspicious about the stated value. All things considered, this seller simply does not inspire my confidence in which case, they seem to me to be one to avoid. That was all.
I get what you and Todd are saying, of course I do. I may seem very black and white but I have dabbled in shades of grey occasionally! We shouldn't make assumptions about the goods being sold by someone who is offering to help avoid tax, but from my perspective, if there were any doubt about those items, I would probably be less inclined to risk buying from this person than someone else who appeared, to me, more above board, shall we say? It may be a completely skewed conclusion, but the impression I get from sellers, influences my buying decisions.
I am so sorry if I have upset anyone. I hope you all know I would never do that deliberately?
Hi Julia,
Not at all (upset). In fact, its the proper attitude you have, and the way things should be. The problem arises from the fact that some of the world does not abide by it. And in these places, if you follow the rules, you will get taken advantage of. Such customs departments are just a source of legal theft and rampant corruption. They just make it up as they go along, based on whatever they can get away with. Its not really a tax in such cases, because you can bet it just goes into a someone’s pocket. So, declaring the wrong value is just an attempt to avoid being stolen from, in some places.
Two wrongs does not make a right, it could be argued. I’m not sure what the correct answer is.
As for this seller, I think a Chinese-porcelain buyer will develop a very bad impression of them over time. I understand Birgit’s opinion, and I think its completely valid. Most of the Chinese items they feature are just not very good at all. Sometimes they have a decent Swatow piece, but not much else. I agree, that many times they must know a Chinese piece is modern, and they just don’t say so. Although, technically not lying (or maybe it is a lie if they say they don’t know..) , or breaking any rules, they could be more forthcoming. It is a business decision and a policy. Its what businesses do, maximizing profit, not breaking laws, but disregarding any higher moral code. A seller such as this, with the volume they handle, is a company, not an individual seller. And companies do not behave like individuals. A Japanese-porcelain buyer will, on the other hand, be quite satisfied. As these issues of honesty do not pertain.
take it with a grain of salt
No problem guys😊
Actually I am surprised that this seller openly offers this 'discount'. Pushing the envelope perhaps a little too far. Normally done by covert agreement! ✉️
From my experience with custom agents most have not a clue. Hence when their in doubt they normally call in a registered expert whose knowledge is very broad etc. I have only once in the past ten years had a parcel intercepted, opened, examined and then cleared for transport. It was ludicrously described with a silly price. However I don't think that was the problem. Apparently it was the antique wooden stand that perked the agents interest. 🤣
Mark
To me too it seems a bit doubtful to offer a wrong declaration so openly. I’m with Julia here. Of course I’m happy if something slips through customs due to wrong declaration but I would never ask the seller to do this. I’ve been to the custom office several times. The guys there are nice and correct, they just do their job. I have always paid the VAT and didn’t feel ripped off.
Birgit
This was interesting and it is good to see both sides of the argument. There is a cultural difference some times, where the shake down is a normal part of life, but it is never pleasant to be the shakee. The more familiar you become with the process, you even begin to negotiate with the shaker. Honesty is the best policy, but both parties, including government representatives, have to adhere to the policy.
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