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I have no idea what to make of these, and as they are damaged they may not interest anyone. They could be fake. They could be genuine. All I can say is they will sell cheap. The rule is never to buy damaged antiques, but there are loopholes, and you could repair this and potentially have a very nice vase for your own enjoyment at a fair price. Then again it could be fake.
My loophole to this rule is if it is a precious antique and selling really cheap if damaged but with room for improvement, then i think it is worth it to have it for your own personal enjoyment. If you were to drop this in detergent and re glue it, you could cover the damage quite considerably.
The first two are definitely old, the oldest , I think, is the second baluster vase, which is C18th, but it has a hole !
There is no way you could repair it easily . Also the decoration is quite crude and not that interesting to be worth spending money to fix it. The first is a fairly common type of export vase , maybe early C19th, but the lid may not be original, it is heavily damaged and you can surely find a better one.
The third is not so old, maybe republican and again of a very common and unremarkable type, also it has three hairlines, certainly not worth bothering about , imo, at any price.
tam
Hi Tam,
I guess, but in good condition you can expect to pay even for the 19th century export a fair sum. This particular vase actually looks very nice, and you might expect to have to pay up to £100 trying to get one with such a lovely painting.
Also if we are to believe the provenance then it would be early 19th century. This will sell for £21 my best guess in the end. The have it cleaned and remove the old brown glue and carefully re glue it. I have seen the royal palace porcelain restore video and i have to say if its good enough for Buckingham Palace then it is good enough as a piece to enjoy.
I was saving up for an auction that is coming up, but i may even buy it. In retrospect I could get a smashing plate for that price but a vase is more fancy. Plates you have to stick in the cupboard or at least i do i have so many.
Qingting has these for sale. Only at £10.
I am sure qingting is selling these so cheap because he recognises these are not the finest decorated items , nor are they very rare , and of course they have quite a bit of damage.
but , for you, why do you want buy such damaged examples? I don't follow your thinking at all. Damaged /repaired items of no special interest or beauty are never going to appreciate significantly in value.
The first vase , the export one, is also , imo, just a very average example, not skilfully executed and the blue is too dark. These kind of export wares were made in their millions in the C18th so there are plenty of better ones available if you are patient.
tam
A damaged item i can get at a fraction of the price of one in good condition. I can then treat it with peroxide and repair it. Until it is no longer noticeable. I then would have it as a nice vase, eventually it may get sold but will fetch slightly more than it was bought for. In the meantime it can be enjoyed.
There may well be beautiful blue & whites out there, but they are not always that easy to find. I generally do get good condition but if something is damaged but very cheap then i might repair it.
The vase in question, the 19th century export. Has lovely shape and style. I guess £16 might be too much with postage. However £12 is something i would consider, because compare that to the Satsuma, Kutani and republic period and the quality of the Satsuma vase while in perfect condition is not as beautiful as blue and white. The blue and white ( not the ugly blue and white) have a value above that standard. So are desirable and will always have a value.
You can see Satsuma going for hundreds of pounds on the more beautiful example from the 19th Century. However the blue and white should be comparable in price almost. There are dreadful blue and white exports that fall below that value. That is where the mid line Satsuma come in and push the away.
This export is not one of the Ugly blue and white of which there are many. It is above that standard in my opinion and with the damage can still easily be comparable to mid to low level Satsuma you might see sell for £15. I use the prices for other stuff to justify a price for that Vase.
Dear Short Dong,
I am in no way aiming to offend you, but to help you, if I can.
You must refine your taste and not look at the price alone.
First at all, you can’t compare the price of a b&w Chinese with a Japanese satsuma. It makes no sense, they are too much different things.
In a certain degree, I agree with you about damaged pieces. I too buy damaged pieces but only if it is worth to do that. Just last Saturday I bought a damaged but fine Qianlong charger decorated with lotus scrolls, a piece that is worth at least 6.000 pounds if not damaged. I paid it 200. Then it is worth the deal.
About the above items that you have shown, Tam is correct in saying that the only one worth to be considered is the 17th century Transitional vase.
Now, think about the following.
If you buy the 19th century vase and you will restore it, you will have in any case something very common, not valuable even if perfect, not interesting, and with no significance under the artistic merit. The painting is of very low level.
If you buy the Transitional one, in that case too you will not have a valuable piece because of the damage, the small size and the not so high level painting. But in that case you have a piece of art, a piece with a strong personality, reflecting the style of the period. If you do not have a Transitional piece, buy that one and you will see the difference with the not valuable, common Kangxi pieces like small dishes that I think you have.
It will be a good way to refine your taste and it will remain long time in your collection, while in the meantime other pieces will go to the garage.
Giovanni
Dear Short Dong,
Why not heed Giovanni's sound advice, save up your money and then buy better quality items with it? Quality will always prevail over quantity at the end of the day.
Since you are based in Ireland, you might care to set some of that money aside and spend it instead at the curated Asian sale that will be held in Adams Sale Rooms on Stephen's Green in Dublin. It's scheduled for 3 November. I will post another thread about this sale closer to the time.
Best wishes,
Alan
Thanks Alan.
Sounds exciting. I actually was not aware of this auction. Great, because Herman and Wilkonson Cancelled or changed the Sep 05th Auction to a household auction.
Giovanni,
Congrats on getting such a fine Charger.
Here is a typical export vase from the lat 19th century and it sold for quite a sum. If i was to get this broken Vase it would be at 15 times less than this price. While not quite Giovanni's division of costs, it is not too far. However indeed it is just a 19th century export, but a very early one.
Dear Short Dong,
actually I would date it to late 19th C.
These was produced at tons. Do not base your judgement on the prices fetched at ebay. Some sellers there are reaching absurd prices, others not at all.
Between this vase and the Transitional one there are oceans of difference.
I would not buy this vase for 50 euro, I would not have pleasure in owning it.
Giovanni
Dear Short Dong,
just to show you if my suggestion to you was a good one or not.
The baluster vase had two bids and was sold for 16 pounds. As said, it has no value; if you had bought it, it will go soon or later to the garage.
The Transitional vase, although missing parts, had 13 bids and was sold for 97 pounds. The evidence is there.
Giovanni
Dear Short Dong,
just to show you if my suggestion to you was a good one or not.
The baluster vase had two bids and was sold for 16 pounds. As said, it has no value; if you had bought it, it will go soon or later to the garage.
The Transitional vase, although missing parts, had 13 bids and was sold for 97 pounds. The evidence is there.
Giovanni
I have learned alot from this, thank you Giovanni.
I am surprised that this sold for £97 that is something and really an education on value.
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