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Hiya, I went on a bit of a famille rose binge. I got these 2 items.
I got this and the porcelain has this modern shine to it, but the style is the usual Export 19th century but slightly different in some small details. Such as the center piece. So i wonder if it could be republican.
I also got this..It is also slightly different with Gold gilding around the center piece, it is a very heavy plate. 12 inches diameter.
Rose mandarin items can best be dated by the persons depicted on them. Unfortunately your pictures don't enlarge and don't show enough details.
Birgit
Hi Shini
Yes, I can get some proper pictures up later. The Famille Rose Comport is new to me. I have both the plat and the Comport and was just being lazy not getting better pictures. I will post them up later.
Shinigami is correct, for some reason the photos don’t enlarge. I think the figures on the plate have a broad expanse between the eyes which is white in colour. I’m sure someone on another threaD said that this characteristic indicates 20th century?
I am testing this to see if the pictures enlarge when i upload them rather than Copy and paste them.
They do enlarge but the bigger they get the fuzzier they are. I think you’ll need to take a closeup photo of the faces.
Okay I have uploaded better pictures
The COMPORT
The Plate/Charger
Comparing the Charger plate and the Comport, the charger plate is much better quality, however the comport is slightly more unusual but certainly not of as good quality. The faces are faded on the Comport and it is not just the picture quality.
Yes, they’ve definitely got a wide nose bridge and pale forehead someone was talking about. I’m sure they said this was late 19th early 20th century.
This vase and bowl in the marketplace has figures with the same feature. I’m sure someone else will come along and give you firmer information.
https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.co.uk%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F362530232945
https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.co.uk%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F223322381435
Yes, I posted this vase earlier. The quality is similar to yours. The butterfly looks similarly done. This is early 20th century.
Yes, I posted this vase earlier. The quality is similar to yours. The butterfly looks similarly done. This is early 20th century.
Yes, I read that thread, and the exterior flowers on the Comport have that same quality.
The Charger Plate must be much earlier if we base age on quality, still the comport has Novelty and will only compliment a full range of Famile rose even if it varies in quality.
I have no idea if quality is an indicator of age with Rose Canton etc. Hopefully someone can enlighten us soon!
Nic
Famille rose only begins from about 1830 , so I think quality is not an indicator of age: decorators , workshops and stylistic trends came and went, and the state of the export market dictated how much time and effort were put into pieces. In the late C19th there was a big upsurge in interest for oriental style (the aesthetic movement etc) , so you would expect Guangxu era famille rose items to be higher quality than earlier and later; I don't know whether that is the case or not.
in the 1920s there was a wave of foreign visitors and tourists to China /Hong Kong and the quality of export and souvenir porcelain mostly declines (not just in porcelain but also in cloisonne, lacquer, wood and ivory carving and silver).
But at any time between 1830 and 1920 you will probably find 'special order ' famille rose of unusually high quality , or on the other side, workshops producing cheap and cheerful pieces.
In terms of value , for famille rose pieces, I think the quality and fineness of the decoration /painting is much more important than the date - 1830 or 1920 won't make much difference. (This is different from blue and white export , where C18th items are generally much better and more desirable than C19th ones).
I don't know how old short-dong's pieces are, maybe they can be dated more precisely from the faces
tam
i meant to write canton famille rose
tam
Both your items as well as the Ebay vase with the dragons are from 1870 +/- 10 years. Generally speaking the quality of Rose mandarin declined from the start in about 1830 until the end of the century: people got smaller and dwarf-like, there was no more gold in the hair after about 1880.
But there were also wide quality differences in items of the same time as can clearly be seen on your two pieces. The skill was still there to make beautiful items, it all depended on what the buyer was willing to pay.
Birgit
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