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Hey all,
So I have found a lot of ten of these that are for sale and my first thoughts were Wanli export, but it isn't my area so I figured I should ask for a second opinion
Thanks ahead of time.
Jeremy
Very nice Kraak dishes, an automatic collection and examples of style. Sharon
Jeremy, not kraak, meaning that they are not Chinese kraak.
They may be Japanese, I don't know, I am not expert about Japanese ceramic, but surely not Chinese kraak.
Regards,
Giovanni
Just looked at the loot, once again my experience is not up to the the par of most but I think they are Kraak, and of the period. What seems a bit odd is all the open space in the paintings. Giovani May be on to something with his Japanese thoughts. It seems to me that most Chinese kraak of this period was a lot busier with less white space. Also most I have seen always seem to depict fauna and flora. Who ever put this collection together seems to of had a theme of people depicted rather than fauna and flora. And what is with the dark spot on all the plates?
i certainly hope for you they do prove to be Chinese, I will concede to the more experienced.
Ron
Ron, sorry, no Chinese kraak, for sure.
Giovanni
@jbeer2121 I bow to the more experienced, so maybe they are Ariita Kraak style but I looked at the Arita plates online and they seemed a deeper blue but that could be due to a difference in photography. In any case, they are nice plates but adjust your budget for them according to what our learned members advise. Sharon
Ron, I also find the dark spot interesting. It is meant to be the sun. As you say, it is hard enough to find a genuine example with anything other than flora and fauna and even plates with this type of decoration ( but not Kraak style) do not have the sun. Once the rather odd appearance, which may be a deception by the unnaturally narrow rim decoration, is factored in as well, then I struggle to see these as genuine Chinese Kraak pieces.
I think the sun is the clue to the age and origin. I have not had much luck finding similar items, but the sun does seem possibly Japanese, certainly I have seen it feature on 20th c pieces.
Hi Jeremy -
Concur with Giovanni, certainty not Chinese Kraak - the painting style and cabolt tone is completely wrong ...
Whether they are Japanese, or an interpretation of such from another South East Asian country, I do not have the knowledge to say ...
Stuart
@jbeer2121 @Julia @romn
Hi Jeremy, Julia, Romn and all -
Just fir reference, attached images/descriptions Kraak dishes with central figural subjects, the image with large/small dishes from the Princesshof National Museum of Ceramics, Leeuwarden, the Netherlands, the other two dishes from a private collection ...
Stuart
@ming1449 @julia @clayandbrush @ronm
Thanks everyone, went to bed super early and woke up to a great lesson. I was wondering why so much space was left in the decorations, I think I may pass unless the price can come down a little bit. I do wonder if it is Japanese, but again haven't found anything quite like it online. I thought perhaps a European attempt at Kraak style, but the foot seems Asian to me. Stuart thank you for the examples of figures in Kraak ware, that is what I was expecting to see, so I was a bit confused.
Thank you all again.
Jeremy
If anyone finds exactly when and where these plates were made, then please post to let us know. Sharon
This is the only one I found to have the blue sun. It has some of the style of the ones you posted. John https://collectionapi.metmuseum.org/api/collection/v1/iiif/714952/1646068/main-imag e" target="true">! https://collectionapi.metmuseum.org/api/collection/v1/iiif/714952/1646068/main-image
I see, on the side. Good find; is it dutch? The link doesn't say, or I missed it. I did check out Dutch items this morning, but didn't think to check any rim decorations.
Chinese, I have just see another very similar.
I also found severL plates ( not kraak) from 17th to 18th c with the sun. Less heavily done, but maybe the impact of that particular element is stronger because they all show it. I found nothing to suggest these are Japanese.
May I ask, is it raining in lots of the plates? Also, in the top row, third along what it that thing in the sky next to what looks like rain falling on the man? The more I look at these, the more fanciful they seem.
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