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Hi All,
A little estate sale find here. A nice little Blanc de Chine cup; I found several basically identical ones online, advertised as late Ming to Kangxi in age. Here are a few links:
Of course, here are a few cheaper ones online, as well, but I didn't find any for less than several hundred dollars. The question is--is this a modern copy, or the real thing? There are several aspects I like--the translucency, the fact that it seems to be entirely hand shaped, even the bottom of the foot. On the other hand, the decoration seems a bit rough, and there are a few deep scratches on the bottom that look suspicious. Is this form commonly faked, and how can I tell? If you tell me these are common museum copies, I will not be surprised.
I did find really cheap Blanc de Chine "rhinocerous-horn" shaped cups online--not quite matching this design--but they are much lower quality.
Thanks,
Charles
I also think it is of a lower quality than those comps. Whether that means it's a modern fake or just a lower grade period example I don't know. I wonder if this form has been made for the past few hundred years and if so there could be multiple grades of quality. If noone knows Peter might be able to tell you.
Hi Julia,
It is a little less well done than the comps. But my photography wasn't the best. Here are a few photos in glancing light, and the show the detail better. John might be right--a slightly lower quality period example? The glaze does seem a little thinner than the period examples (hence, the bare spots), and it is a little asymmetric, but the quality of decoration doesn't seem that different. I may have to double my investment in this and ask Peter...
Those are better pictures, make sure those are the ones you send to Peter. 😊 I only have one piece of blanc de chine and know little about these cups, so I would be interested to hear what he says, if that is OK with you, of course.
Hi Julia,
I finally got around to asking Peter. He says it is real. Late 17th to early 18th century (probably early Kangxi, in his opinion). He says it is a perfectly typical Dehua "rhinoceros horn"-shaped cup.
Charles
@kirby13 Hello Charles.
Not to be the contrarian, but most late Ming to Kangxi Dehua pieces acquire a pinkish tint to the paste, and are rather heavily potted.
Photos often filter out the pink color, but the body looks a bit refined as well. Have you found a comparable with the exact design?
Late 18th c Dehua is generally milk white, and 19th c have a slight gray tint.
Modern copies can be very deceptive… even copying the pink tint, but rarely can they get the heavy potting correct, nor the designs.
I’m just being cautious.
Hi Greeno,
Here is a nearly identical one from Robert McPherson:
Here is another with the same design, from Marchant:
Here is another, although this one has remains of applied colors:
Chinese Blanc de Chine Porcelain Magnolia Blossom Cup | Vanderven
Here is another with a similar design. but looking a bit more worn. It has the pinkish cast you were mentioning.
Wine Cup with Applied Plum Blossom Decor (Dehua ware) – Works – Worcester Art Museum (emuseum.com)
Charles
The design looks great!
The foot on the McPherson cup and the Worcester Museum cup have a distinctive texture that Kangxi Dehua generally have… pitting and small firing cracks.
The pink tint could just be a matter of photography, but I have clients who swear by it.
There is also a heaviness to early Dehua, too, that later versions lack.
Honestly, I wouldn’t be able to tell for certain without handling it.
Charles,
Your cup is interesting in that it is thinner and seemingly, lightly glazed. Its nice. I feel like it is just wonderful in the hand. I also think it is okay.
I think, as far as my research has taken me, there are certain wares of the 18th century in the Dehua Kiln system where they were potting lighter and lighter..... I think the detail within the petals, and blossoms indicate an earlier date.
I ask that you feel for the thinness of the paste, is it smooth? It should not grab your fingertips, they should just glide over. Dehua had some of the finest porcelain to work with.
I will add pics of a Dehua Jue that I acquired not long back and took with me to a major DC museum, and the curator, as well as her underlings agreed was correct for the early to mid 18th century Dehua wares, meant for ritual use, whatever that means.
I think your Libation cup is okay, though I would not compare it to the 17th century wares, perhaps 18th/19th. but do tell is the paste smooth as hell?
Jeremy
Sorry, if I misled you, at least you can be confident that Peter knows a lot more than I do.
Interestingly, I didn’t realise this was an old thread and when I saw the pictures I had exactly the same thought as I did the first time. I will have to up my research on these pieces and train my eye better. 😊
Jeremy,
The bottom is incredibly smooth; it almost feels soapy. I didn't notice that before. My finger actually slides over the unglazed bottom easier than over the glaze...
Charles
Hi Jeremy, just curious about the curator of the museum, do you know her personally? or is it anybody can take stuff to the museum? Thanks.
Yin
Hey Yin,
This was a case where I was invited to a friend's house for dinner, and this was someone they knew, I forgot this was in my bag when I went.... I have found here in DC at least, that most of the federally funded museums will give a response, you may just need to try a few different people. Just don't over burden them with a bunch of things, and save the email for pieces that are truly special.
Jeremy
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