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The BidAmount Asian Art Forum | Chinese Art

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Need help dating these two qianjiang dishes, please

 
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 CarolT
(@cashflowz)
Reputable Member
Joined: 5 years ago
Posts: 164
Topic starter 25/02/2023 5:04 pm  

I have two qianjiang-style dishes, about 15.5 cm across and about 7 cm high, each with a turquoise interior and a Tongzhi mark on the foot. One is quatre-lobed and the other tri-lobed. Each is painted in soft colors with a landscape scene, buildings among trees and hills/mountains, with a lone boatman off to one side. Brief inscriptions, but no date. As far as I can tell, the marks, though faint, are handwritten rather than stamped. The scenes are similar, but the calligraphers are clearly not the same.

I am thinking that they may be rather early for qianjiang, perhaps either Tongzhi or early Guangzu, but am far from being an expert, and would greatly appreciate your help.

Carol

Q1
Q inscription
Qmark
T1
T inscription
Tmark

 


   
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Brian Crowe
 Brian Crowe
(@lotusblack)
Illustrious Member
Joined: 4 years ago
Posts: 4241
25/02/2023 5:07 pm  

Need to see the foot.


   
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 CarolT
(@cashflowz)
Reputable Member
Joined: 5 years ago
Posts: 164
Topic starter 25/02/2023 6:04 pm  

@lotusblack I apologize; I forgot to send those pictures. Thanks, Brian.

 

DSCF3765
DSCF3760

   
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Brian Crowe
 Brian Crowe
(@lotusblack)
Illustrious Member
Joined: 4 years ago
Posts: 4241
25/02/2023 7:06 pm  

I think it’s ok for Tongzhi but could be Guangxu the neatly trimming of the foot points Guangxu but this Kiln did better quality pieces so could be Tongzhi. I don’t think it really makes any difference.


   
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 CarolT
(@cashflowz)
Reputable Member
Joined: 5 years ago
Posts: 164
Topic starter 26/02/2023 7:53 am  

Thank you again, Brian. You wrote "this Kiln did better quality pieces." Do you know which kiln may have done these? I find it interesting that they are similar in landscape design but by different calligraphers.

Carol


   
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Yin Hall
 Yin Hall
(@yinchris)
Noble Member
Joined: 4 years ago
Posts: 584
26/02/2023 9:04 am  

The first calligraphy is "夜半钟声到客船“  second is ”山间 (?) 楼台一小舟" .  


   
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Brian Crowe
 Brian Crowe
(@lotusblack)
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Posts: 4241
26/02/2023 9:22 am  

I wouldn’t know the exact kiln but Qianjiang style pottery tended to be of higher quality it wasn’t as mass produced and ruffly potted as other pieces from the same period. It was a time were the artist was given more freedom to express their individual style.


   
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Greeno107
 Greeno107
(@greeno107)
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26/02/2023 9:34 am  

@cashflowz Hi Carol!

This beautiful bowl, unless it was produced as a blank in the Tongzhi, is after the Tongzhi period, but before the Republic period, due to the quality and spectrum of enamels.

More narrow a time frame is only possible with the artist name or date.

Read this article for a bit more context.

http://www.koh-antique.com/qj/qjmain.html


   
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 CarolT
(@cashflowz)
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Joined: 5 years ago
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Topic starter 26/02/2023 9:59 am  

@yinchris Thank you, Yin.


   
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 CarolT
(@cashflowz)
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Joined: 5 years ago
Posts: 164
Topic starter 26/02/2023 10:03 am  

@greeno107 Thank you, Brian and Tim. Tim, the reason I wondered whether they might be as early as Tongzhi is that the marks appear to be handwritten rather than stamped, although the second bowl is so faint that it is hard to tell. But I am happy with a Guangxu date. Yes, Mr. Koh's site is full of excellent information. Again, thank you both.


   
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 CarolT
(@cashflowz)
Reputable Member
Joined: 5 years ago
Posts: 164
Topic starter 01/03/2023 10:43 am  

@greeno107 Although these bowls are undated, I was told by a Gotheborg poster that the name of the artist on the second bowl is Yifeng. I cannot find that name, but was wondering if anyone on this forum had ever heard of him.

Thanks lots,

Carol


   
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Greeno107
 Greeno107
(@greeno107)
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01/03/2023 11:04 am  

@cashflowz Sorry, Carol.  I rely on my Chinese speaking/reading friends for help on signatures.  Since you are familiar with Koh Antiques, they have a section of Qianjiang images sorted by style of rendering (birds and flowers, people, landscapes), then sorted by year made.  Start with the earliest and work your way through... perhaps you'll cross a similar example.


   
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 CarolT
(@cashflowz)
Reputable Member
Joined: 5 years ago
Posts: 164
Topic starter 01/03/2023 11:10 am  

@greeno107 Thank you, Tim. I have gone through his examples by subject and by artist before, but need to do so again. And again. My eye is not yet trained well enough to easily recognize similarities, especially in calligraphy. But I will keep trying!

Carol


   
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